LA Angels Tuesday News Crash: Mike Trout

Yes. That’s Perry Minasian calling everyone in a bid to replace Logan O’Hoppe. Seriously though, are there options?

GhostGuest wrote this article to alert us to another impending great achievement by Mike Trout. Mark Gubicza discusses the difference between starting games and closing games. He did both.

Rob Manfred feels sorry for Oakland As fans. He says it is not the owner’s fault the team is moving.

The Reds designated infielder Jason Vosler for assignment and brought up Henry Ramos. Jose Altuve is reportedly ahead of schedule in coming back from his thumb surgery. Joe Kelly was just freed from the 15 day injured list. The Athletics acquired left-hander Sam Long from the Giants for cash considerations.

Drew Smyly was pitching a perfect game until the eighth inning. Then it was not so perfect.

So I guess Jacob deGrom is not injured.

Photo credit: Rex Fregosi

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FungoAle
Legend
1 year ago

Syndergaard pulled a Suarez tonight, how sad

Twebur
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  FungoAle

Only difference is the Doyers came back and won 8-7….even held onto the lead in the bottom of the 9th….and made it looked easy. Must be nice

GrandpaBaseball
Legend
1 year ago

Does Shohei love being on the Angels? “Money can’t buy me love” may apply, we shall see-see rider on the magic bus. 🎶 

RexFregosi
Super Member
1 year ago

all his BFFs are in Anaheim.

He will be staying.

Rallymanatee
Trusted Member
1 year ago
Reply to  RexFregosi

Not Maldy

GrandpaBaseball
Legend
1 year ago

On a positive note; Happy to see Drury deliver last night, hope this is the start of something special. Renfroe is on a roll now too. Ac ouple of weeks ago some were thinking tar and feathers for PTP. Patience and we will prevail.

Wallach is showing some signs of hitting, but he was PH for by Thaiss late in the game, go figure, but Thaiss walked! Better to be lucky than good.

Trout has now missed 3 Homerun hit balls that a younger Trout would of possibly brought back into the stadium. I do hope Trouty goes on a roll soon and shows he needs to be still thought of as elite rather than just very good. I truly think the world of him and even at my age I still have heroes.

The bottom of the line up from 5-9 really rocked last night.

Do I think Suarez was tipping pitches? Velo is down, putting the ball over the middle of the plate and throwing mostly one pitch that’s not working might all have something to do with the issues of his 2023 pitching issues.

Who do you trust, Loup? Tepera? How about Q? Warren. I think we wantz moore and better Bullpen, but maybe that’s just me.

TrojanBoiler
Trusted Member
1 year ago

That is a great point. I was so angry I kind of forgot about how good Drury looked. 2 HRs and a beautiful piece of hitting on that RBI single. The HR in extras was huge too, obviously.

Cowboy26
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  TrojanBoiler

Sorry too late . Even though he’s signed for 2 years time to tear this shit show down.

RexFregosi
Super Member
1 year ago
Reply to  TrojanBoiler

None of us should ever should forget that catch Taylor made either – ran a long way and stole a grand slam in 9th inning of tie game. Panther move.

GrandpaBaseball
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  RexFregosi

Oversight on my part, robbing that GS was awesome too.

GrandpaBaseball
Legend
1 year ago

We have been all over the evaluation map when it comes to Rengifo. I have let it be known, for years in fact, that I am not a fan of his game play. I know of his speed, again aware of the numbers he can put on the books in the minors with his bat and speed. He cannot bring his minor league game to the majors for several reasons.

What makes a Superstar is their natural athleticism and this includes the natural ability to not only have the coordination, which by the way Rengifo has, but also the ability to slow the game down mentally and react without thinking about what they are going to do right on the spot.

Rengifo vs Fletcher. Before a ball is hit to him Fletcher will quickly analysis what he will do if the ball is hit to him, he wants the ball hit to him and he makes it look easy in getting the out. Rengifo does that only some of the time because for him the game is going quicker in his head. His reactions are to react as the hit ball is on it’s way to him, and then takes a moment to make a decision on what to do and he sometimes makes the play, but more than the average player he makes a mistake. He does this on the base paths, he does this at the plate.

Last season we all applauded him for his success, at least at the plate as he was very successful, this season he started out working the pitcher and was drawing walks and getting on base. Now the mistakes are showing up in all facets of his game, first pitch swinging, base running, and fielding.

If we were coaching him a good starting point would be repetition and focus as this may slow the game down for him. He has certainly had enough ML At Bats and has shown a lack of consistent play above average. You can’t teach speed or arm strength, which is natural, and he has both, but lack of Baseball IQ or thinking ahead of a play and wanting the ball hit to him has and will hold him back.

aces666high
Trusted Member
1 year ago

He hit those homers in bunches last season and fooled everyone.

Cowboy26
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  aces666high

No he hit those homers against LHPs last year and fooled everyone. Hes never had any sustained success from the left side at the ML level. This year is no different.

gitchogritchoffmypettis
Legend

Rengifo could light himself on fire and it won’t change the fact that David Fletcher really sucks right now and had an option.

Fansince1971
Legend
1 year ago

Not an option re Fletch -passed through waivers unclaimed.

Cowboy26
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  Fansince1971

He can be added back on the 40 man in a millisecond. OHoppe’s going on 60 day IL so Poof ! now theres an open spot . The only issue is that after the Angels bring up Fletch the next time they can’t option him

Fansince1971
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  Cowboy26

I would think they would use O’Hoppe’s spot for a pitcher

GrandpaBaseball
Legend
1 year ago

Sub out Fletcher and add Simba, not advocating for Fletcher’s return here.

Jeff Joiner
Editor
Legend
1 year ago

Said it last night and it bears repeating:

I fully understand the goal of resting Quijada and others last night. However, when the team had fought back so hard to take a late lead, you have to change that plan and go for the W. Quijada had Sunday off.

Not all wins and losses are the same. Last night is the type of win that can energize a club.

Instead we got a loss that was incredibly deflating.

Guest
1 year ago
Reply to  Jeff Joiner

I get knocked down! But I get up again!
You are never gonna keep me down!  🎶 

Jeff Joiner
Editor
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to 

Funny story about that song. When I worked in radio, I met the guy who discovered Chumbawumba.

He was a lifelong A and R guy (dude who finds bands) and a workaholic. His wife was about to leave him due to his workaholic ways so he decided to take a vacation to Europe with her. No work, just fun, to repair the relationship.

A few nights into the trip they are out having a couple of drinks and this crazy band comes on stage. He knows right then he wants to sign them. He promised his wife no work, but he also just knows they will be huge.

Needless to say, he signed them, brought them here, and they made a fortune off that one song. The wife didn’t leave him, and he did take her on another trip with some of the money.

Eric_in_Portland
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  Jeff Joiner

he probably made more off of that song than they did. Record companies are notorious for ripping off artists by charging all cost against them, instead of divvying up the profits.

JackFrost
Super Member
1 year ago
Reply to  Jeff Joiner

Agree. Not only that Jeff, but if a guy is not made unavailable because he has simply pitched too much (for example a Closer gets you saves on Mon. and Tues night and threw say 50-60 pitches) and you says he’s sitting Wed., then, yeah. If he has been used too much then you state before the game that he is unavailable tonight. But NEITHER Quijada nor Estevez had pitched alot lately… Estevez pitched a rather non-strenuous inning on Sunday, and he has not pitched on back to back days so far this season… And as you mentioned, Q had not pitched since Saturday.

Outside of being made unavailable due to overuse in the preceding days you can’t hold good relief pitchers out in a game where you need them to win on the idea of giving them “rest.” That’s because you don’t know if you’ll even need them at all for the next 5-6 games.. Let’s say the Angels play 5 games in a row that are lopsided one way or the other… What were you saving your two best pitchers for ??

There was really no excuse to use neither of those guys in the 9th yesterday.

Last edited 1 year ago by JackFrost
Cowboy26
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  JackFrost

Oh boy Frostie its apparent that your gritty logic does not correlate with Perrys. https://twitter.com/JeffFletcherOCR/status/1650751749177872384

gitchogritchoffmypettis
Legend
Reply to  Cowboy26

Isn’t this what people here were saying last year? The only answer is to get like 12 reliable relievers… and then lose your shit when ever any of them fail.

Jeff Joiner
Editor
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  Cowboy26

Ok, well I assert that we’re under .500 and lost to a shitty team because exactly 1 good reliever who didn’t pitch the day prior was made unavailable.

Having the good guys fresh and ready to roll once we’re 10 game out isn’t going to help.

JackFrost
Super Member
1 year ago
Reply to  Jeff Joiner

Exactly !!

Eric_in_Portland
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  Cowboy26

I believe that is an incorrect assessment of 2022.

Cowboy26
Legend
1 year ago

I’m not sure what to believe on this but it’s not like teams haven’t used individual relievers with a lot more frequency over the past decades. but Whats concerning is this comment:

Many around the Angels believe that’s exactly what happened last year, contributing to the team’s collapse after a hot start. 

Which means that there are more in the organization than just Perry that believe this way.

gitchogritchoffmypettis
Legend
Reply to  Cowboy26

What would the actual players know? I have been an Angels fan since Rupert Jones was snorting cocaine of Jimmy Reese’s tits while the Big A was still part of the stadium and the bathrooms were just seat holes above a water tunnel that lead to the river. A young plebe boy would give you a stick with a sponge on it to wipe. You could purchase those boys….. anyway. Nolan Ryan. Rod Carew. Gene Autry would have won seventy WS by now. Real baseball men. I have PTSD from nothing. I know what the players are thinking. I am The Shadow. Back in my day the men were men and the sheep were nervous. Dodge Colt!

Cowboy26
Legend
1 year ago

I think Fletch is referencing other front office people in the organization not the players.

Nobody gives a shit what they think. (Except Ohtani’s mom of course)

Twebur
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  Cowboy26

I’m starting to think Molly Jolly is the mastermind behind this shit-show and not Arte.

Cowboy26
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  Twebur

Possibly. My Brother in Law knows her husband. I can tell you that He ain’t no mastermind.

Rallymanatee
Trusted Member
1 year ago
Reply to  Jeff Joiner

You sound like the old guard. Like Joe Maddon.

FungoAle
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  Rallymanatee

Maddon is like an old penny, did a podcast on the Athletic today. Don’t need him to comment on the Angels. Rinse and repeat.

Cowboy26
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  FungoAle

Soggy Joe slowly circling the drain. What a sad ending to an almost HOF career.

aces666high
Trusted Member
1 year ago

I’ll try and dump the link here but it was posted on Reddit on the angels sub that Suarez was ripping his pitches, Ohtani noticed it in the 3rd, he adjusted and didn’t give up anything from there out.

Yes Ohtani noticed, not our pitching coach. Apologies if the link doesn’t work.

https://www.reddit.com/r/angelsbaseball/comments/12yqrf4/suarez_was_tipping_his_pitches_shohei_noticed_it/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=ioscss&utm_content=2&utm_term=1

DowningDude
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  aces666high

Trout also noticed and went to speak to Nevin about it.

Twebur
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  DowningDude

May as well have Trout and Shohei take on pitching coach duties too.🚽🧻💩

aces666high
Trusted Member
1 year ago
Reply to  DowningDude

All the while Wise was doing what..staring off into space?

Ohtani is as good as gone. Feelers should be out to see what they can get back. Hopefully they’re not delusional. There’s no way he re signs with an organization that can’t take care of their players.

gitchogritchoffmypettis
Legend
Reply to  aces666high

If the Angels suck enough to not sign Ohtani it could save the next ten years of the team. Fate opens a bathroom window….

Cowboy26
Legend
1 year ago

But can she pitch?

aces666high
Trusted Member
1 year ago

The big A does need a bit of airing out

clover_black
Super Member
1 year ago
Reply to  aces666high

that camera the japanese fan has is pretty sweet

Jeff Joiner
Editor
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  aces666high

Trout noticed a guy last year. Ohtani and Trout noticed this year.

At some point you’d expect a pitching coach to notice.

On the plus side, hopefully this fixes Suarez from this point forward.

Guest
1 year ago
Reply to  Jeff Joiner

A few years ago, Ohtani threw a pitch and wanted the ball back, but to his surprise, his catcher, Martin Maldonado, called for the trainer and Ohtani, who didn’t even know he was hurt, went on the IL and then had his elbow sliced up by Dr. ElAttrache.

Jeff Joiner
Editor
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to 

Maldonado has done that a few times.

Guy is going to make an incredible manager some day. His eye for the total game is astounding.

Cowboy26
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  Jeff Joiner

I wouldn’t hire him as hitting coach though.

aces666high
Trusted Member
1 year ago
Reply to  Jeff Joiner

Top to bottom, I have little to no faith in this organization. Wether it’s the trainers, the coaches, upper management etc, it’s a chicken sh!t outfit.

When you don’t want to send your radio crew out on road games to save pennies, that speaks volumes to me.

FungoAle
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  aces666high

I have faith talent overcomes crappy management. We need to players to put on the big boy pants and start crushing the baseball.

Dogface1956
Trusted Member
1 year ago
Reply to  FungoAle

Gotta have “big boy pants” along with grit, lots of grit and clutch, need to be clutchie. If the Angels all had grit (with stubble), lots of clutch and wear their big boy pants they will be unbeatable. That plus the ability to turn the page and get out of their own way and they would be perfect the rest of the season.

Marcotor
Trusted Member
1 year ago
Reply to  Dogface1956

But they need the King God of All Grit, Erstad to manage.
And some major dick-swinging. Think Weaver as pitching coach.
They would win 200 games every year just on grit and swinging!

Cowboy26
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  Marcotor

Percy is also a pretty good dick swinger.

aces666high
Trusted Member
1 year ago
Reply to  FungoAle

It will to a certain extent I agree but this team has blown multiple games early that were well in hand and lost more than a few games in embarrassing fashion. I’m sure doubt has more than crept into their heads. No one would blame them for having no faith in the bullpen, Nevin and his moves, the training staff etc.

They’ve fought back hard in a few games only to watch it all burn in front of them. One tough loss can send a team spiraling, the angels have a nice list going already in this young season.

gitchogritchoffmypettis
Legend
Reply to  FungoAle

Oh NO! Can’t blame the actual men who actually fail at baseball! No. It’s the owner (who is in Arizona?). How can you expect Mike Fkn Trout to get a game winning RBI when he knows that when he’s on the road Mark Langston is at home? And Arte won’t go buy the trainers who know an injury will happen before it happens. So lame. It’s not the players. No sir.

MarineLayer
Super Member
1 year ago
Reply to  aces666high

Why do the Angels even employ coaches and a manager if they can’t even do the most rudimentary parts of their job. This organization is a joke that isn’t very funny.

aces666high
Trusted Member
1 year ago
Reply to  MarineLayer

Top to bottom, a chicken shit operation.

gitchogritchoffmypettis
Legend
Reply to  aces666high

Hell yeah. Fk the Angels. Or Fk you. I’ll decide!

Guest
1 year ago

Fk you and God bless!

Last edited 1 year ago by GhostGuest
gitchogritchoffmypettis
Legend
Reply to 

Bless our hearts.

Twebur
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  aces666high

chicken.wav – Padre Manager Dick Williams: “Talk about chicken sh*t.” 

Guest
1 year ago

Great, timely hit Rengifo. Now don’t don’t do anything crazy on the base paths.

comment image

DowningDude
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to 

That was truly “the Halo Way”

HalosFanForLife
Trusted Member
1 year ago

Don’t look now, but Neto is heating up. Even as fast as he was moved up, I am starting to think the only time he’ll see the minors again is in a rehab assignment. I think we found ourselves a gem. I love his engine and intent. It’s so nice to see an actual SS playing SS too.

Cowboy26
Legend
1 year ago

So Trade him! before its too late!

Fansince1971
Legend
1 year ago

I view Neto and O’Hoppe as the future. Makes me way more excited than Trout or Ohtani.

TrojanBoiler
Trusted Member
1 year ago

This team will not break .500 under our current manager. Bullpen management has been atrocious, along with general decision making. The team looks disengaged and disinterested half the time. Bad players are being put in a position to fail and good players are not being given an opportunity. It’s been frustrating to watch.

Twebur
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  TrojanBoiler

campanis.wav – Tommy Lasorda on whose fault it is: “Ain’t my f***ing fault? Campanis is the f***ing guy.” 

FungoAle
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  Twebur

Looking for the Kurt Bevacqua and Kingman .wav files. Maybe a little bit of Bruce Bennedict too.

Twebur
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  FungoAle

bev-boat.wav – Tommy Lasorda on Rengifo and Kurt Bevacqua: “Or f***ing Bevacqua, who couldn’t hit water if he fell out of a f***ing boat.” 

FungoAle
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  Twebur

shit never gets old…thanks

FungoAle
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  TrojanBoiler

Even with the pen situation, I think Angels will break .500. Angels are 1 game under with 139 games to go.

Fansince1971
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  FungoAle

Mmmm – not so sure. I realize there are a lot of games left but this has been a very easy part of the schedule. The bullpen as built will limit any consistency and long winning streaks.

FungoAle
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  Fansince1971

There are a lot of marginal teams in the AL, when I stack up the Angels against the other teams, should overcome.

Fansince1971
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  FungoAle

May will be the tale of the tape. If they can escape that month at around 500, I think that bodes well. If at the end of May they are something like 10 or 15 games under 500, I’m not sure how they get out of that hole.

Last edited 1 year ago by Fansince1971
gitchogritchoffmypettis
Legend
Reply to  Fansince1971

This makes sense to me.

TrojanBoiler
Trusted Member
1 year ago
Reply to  Fansince1971

Yeah I agree with this as well. But I don’t think Nevin can manage us to that record over the month of May. He’s too dumb.

JackFrost
Super Member
1 year ago
Reply to  FungoAle

Yes, but look at who we’ve played… The A’s, Nats and Royals made a good chuck of those games…

gitchogritchoffmypettis
Legend
Reply to  FungoAle

Gotta love CtPG guy.

“There is no way this team can even break .500 with tharse manager and Anderson and bullpen and which ever players are cold right now! No. Way. I don’t care how many games are left in the season! If you think we can win 82 games you are Pollyanna.”

“When the new owner comes in we will pay Ohtani 10/550M. Plus paying Trout and Rendon. But because no one pays 6 billion for a baseball team and then doesn’t go all in, the new owners will also spend liberally on several other players because Troutani will demand support and Arte is gone. All of these free agents will suddenly perform as expected because arte is gone. They will also spend a ton on the farm for sure. They will also build a stadium with their own money. This is what will surely happen. Steve Balmer is a person who is alive.”

These two lines of thinking have come out of the same hive mind.

What was really really frustrating about last night is that, even with our offense still hampered by some dead cold hitters, with O’Hoppe, Stassi, Walsh out, with most of the bullpen arms spent so we have to pitch the scraps, with our worst starter serving up a gopher feast…. we still kept clawing and almost won.

All it takes is a couple things flopping from bad to good and we win a lot more games. I have seen the Reds. I know what hopeless looks like. The Angels are far from hopeless and .500 (which would be a big improvement over last year) isn’t that crazy a dream.

TrojanBoiler
Trusted Member
1 year ago

I agree with most of what you are saying here. Cold players, spent bullpen, etc. There were challenges outside of anyone’s control. However, this is the type of situation where your manager’s capability is magnified. I feel like better management absolutely could have put us into a better position to win last night.

If Nevin was going to use Tucky D anyway, then why wait until the 6th to bring him in? Why not pull a struggling Suarez earlier, try to run Davidson for 5 or 6 innings, and then bring in Wantz at the end? Same impact to the bullpen, but it could have made a meaningful difference in the score.

I think the batting order needs some review as well. Ward is struggling and should be moved from his lead off spot. I am confident that he will get himself figured out, but let’s not put the team in a bad situation while we wait for things to click.

The way this team is constructed (top heavy bullpen, mediocre defense, offensive depth, utility players), it is going to require savvy management to maximize our wins. Nevin all year has looked mentally overmatched. If our best bet was to trot the same guys out onto the field every night, then sure he’s fine. But this roster will need smart decisions to fully utilize the talent I think it has.

Fansince1971
Legend
1 year ago

My man – I agree those 2 things are conflicting and silly.

We also agree this team could finish the year around 80-82 wins as built. But is that the organizational goal this year in that it almost assuredly means Ohtani goes elsewhere? That then leads into the conflicting statements you identified.

What I disagree with is your statement that hovering around 500 thus far means something not bad. The Angels have played the majority of their games against really bad baseball teams. They should be feasting on those clubs, and instead are pretty much playing even with them. That does not bode well for when the schedule turns more difficult.

Also, it’s the manner in which they are losing games. The weaknesses are pretty clear to see. And they are the same weaknesses that we have been watching for approximately the last five seasons. That is the concern. The blown lead games piling up – the bullpen’s inability to hold leads. I expect these to be further exposed when the team plays better opponents.

Yes, the team came back and showed some heart last night. That’s great but it was against a really crappy Oakland pitching staff. Playing teams that are actually good, that is not likely to happen.

JackFrost
Super Member
1 year ago
Reply to  Fansince1971

Indeed. When we play the Rays, Astros and Rangers we’ll lose 2 of 3, or worse, get swept !

Last edited 1 year ago by JackFrost
DowningDude
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  JackFrost

Oh man!!!! Now you jinxed THOSE TEAMS who will now lose 1 or 2 games to the Halos. Their fan base will tar, feather, torch and pitchfork you all at once!!!

JackFrost
Super Member
1 year ago
Reply to  DowningDude

Yes ! That is the idea. Do you understand anything DD?

Everybody knows you don’t step on the foul line when you are running back from your position to the dugout, likewise back to the field !! I dare you to tell all those players they are being irrational.

gitchogritchoffmypettis
Legend
Reply to  JackFrost

Or, suddenly, we have a bunch of guys that start playing like their balls are on fire and we win a bunch of games against good teams. It happens. Players like Anderson, our bullpen, Rengifo and even Poop aren’t static. IF they “click” or what ever then things will improve. Most likely, some will improve, some won’t. But, at this point, constantly extrapolating that Tree = Toothpicks is actually just as big a leap of faith as saying this team will go to the WS because the Phillies did last year.

Though, honestly, does this fanbase deserve a WS trip? And it will only make Arte look good…. can’t have that…. are we actually getting what we collectively wish for? Did you know Uranus has a fuzzy core and it rains diamonds there because of the pressure? The universe is a wild place….

Guest
1 year ago

Anaheim Stadium was one strike away from turning into Fantasyland! And now the Red Sox have a 6-5 lead.

smithy610
Super Member
1 year ago
Reply to  Fansince1971

I would have been more “impressed” with clawing back from an almost guaranteed loss, down 7-1, if it was done against other middle-of-the pack or even top tier teams. A loss is a loss, sure, but a loss like last night would probably sting less if it was against the Astros – it gives you confidence that the team can go toe-to-toe with those types of teams. Then you get even more confident that the team just needs a few tweaks, and it’s not too crazy to hope that others will eventually improve on their performance and hit the mean (Ward, Anderson, etc.)

But oh well. It’s only April.

Troutstrikeout
Trusted Member
1 year ago

.500 wouldn’t be that crazy of a dream? So .500 is our WS now, that’s the dream? Are you ducking kidding me? We haven’t had a winning season since trout was 24 or made the playoffs since he was 23, but oh boy we might DREAM of .500 in his age 31 season, with Ohtani. What an effing joke.

This roster isn’t the Braves or Astros, those teams more talented. But this team this year should make the playoffs even win 90 which isn’t that tall a task, not 100 not 95 but 90. It is way underperforming, 2-2 run differential of -3 to the 7-31 royals and athletics.

Hopeless is the Reds??! Lmao!!!!! The reds didn’t waste 8 years of trouts prime and 5 years of Ohtanis with them together. MLB teams never get that chance and we completely wasted it with 8 straight losing seasons. That’s hopeless! Btw the reds had 2 straight winning seasons in 2020 and 2021.

Oh my GAWD you lower the bar, set expectations low. After 8 years of 70-92 to 75-87 we might go .500 in trouts age 31-32 season with goat Ohtani, HUGE improvement over last years complete debacle underperformance yayyyyy!!!! Lmfao what a joke

GrandpaBaseball
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  Troutstrikeout

Why are you here on an Angels site again? What is your real agenda? Even your name/handle is negative. 2023 is a new year, we can all hope for different results, and we will keep our asses on thank you.

gitchogritchoffmypettis
Legend
Reply to  Troutstrikeout

“I EITHER DON’T READ ALL THE COMMENTS IN A THREAD OR I HAVE READING COMPREHENSION ISSUES! BUT I CAN GO ZERO TO 60 ON THE RED ASS SCALE AFTER READING ONE SENTENCE IN A COMMENT THAT WAS ACTUALLY REFERENCING ANOTHER GUY’S STATEMENT. NOW I WILL LIST A BUNCH OF SAD HISTORICAL SHIT THAT HAS NO ACTUAL BERRING ON TODAY’S TEAM BEFORE BLATHERING ABOUT BARS AND GOALS AND PERFORMANCE TO A GUY WHO DOESN”T HAVE ANY INFLUENCE ON WHAT THE ANGELS DO. MY POLO SHIRT MADE OUT OF RECYCLED TRASH BAGS KEPT ME DRY ALMOST THE WHOLE TIME! I WILL RESPOND TO THIS COMMENT WITH SOMETHING ABOUT HISTORY BEING A PREDICTOR BECAUSE I LOVE CLICHES ALMOST AS MUCH AS I LOVE NEW BALANCE SHOES! I COMPLAIN LIKE A REAL MAN WITH REAL DEMANDS!”

Yes, I do actually want them to get to .500. would I prefer better? Sure. If you’re understanding is that I would NOT want to win 95 or what ever I can’t help you with what’s causing that. But my first ask is for the team to be 9 or 10 games better than last year. Any more than that is a bonus. And then the same next year. Until we win 162, cause my bar is high as shit.

Not sure it will happen though. I think the Angels may be a backdoor way that the universe kills off twats with hypertension.

Last edited 1 year ago by gitchogritchoffmypettis
Fansince1971
Legend
1 year ago

The Angels won 73 games last year. That with with Ohtani having an arguably MVP season and Trout hitting 40-plus.

So an 8 game improvement to 81 wins would be significant and positive for sure. I agree.

To rationally think the team will improve 15 or even 20 games in a season is magic thinking. It rarely happens in baseball. Everything would have to break the Angels’ way.

I think most want the magic because it might mean Ohtani will hang around. But I think it’s healthier to presume he is gone. Then if by some stroke of luck the Angels do make the playoffs and Ohtani stays, it will be a happy surprise.

Cowboy26
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  Fansince1971

To rationally think the team will improve 15 or even 20 games in a season is magic thinking. It rarely happens in baseball. Everything would have to break the Angels’ way.

Uh you realize that this typically happens to at least 2 teams in MLB every year right? The Angels have experienced this “oddity” a few times themselves in the last 25 years.

1999 to 2000 +12
2001 to 2002 +24
2003 to 2004 +15
2013 to 2014 +20



Fansince1971
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  Cowboy26

Very rare for it to happen. Everything has to break correctly which it clearly has not thus far.

Cowboy26
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  Fansince1971

6-14 gotcha.

FungoAle
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  Fansince1971

Happens way more than you think. Baseball is one sport where you can go worst to first a year later. 1990 Twins was another team.

gitchogritchoffmypettis
Legend
Reply to  FungoAle

Yup. also, there have been some pretty meh teams that crossed the All Star break and then went apeshit. Cause BASEBALL Ray!

Cowboy26
Legend
1 year ago

2021 MLB World Series Champions .

FungoAle
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  FungoAle

2016 Twins +26 game swing to 2017. Hell, I just picked one random team and isolated two instances and only a half a beer down plus need to finish the rest of Twins franchise history

Troutstrikeout
Trusted Member
1 year ago
Reply to  Fansince1971

Giants went from under .500 to 107 wins in 2021. We can go from 73 to 90 with a way more talented team and the additions we got

Troutstrikeout
Trusted Member
1 year ago
Reply to  Troutstrikeout

We won’t but we should

gitchogritchoffmypettis
Legend
Reply to  Troutstrikeout

Sure, we can. No sarcasm. It can happen. It’s unlikely, but it’s not like we’re totally bereft of guys who can accomplish that.

gitchogritchoffmypettis
Legend
Reply to  Fansince1971

CtPG. How does this collection of chapped assholes manage to spend so much time believing they deserve some level of baseball magic?

If we get a 15 game bump from last years carcass I will totally take it, play offs or no. And fk Ohtani and what ever his mom is feeling. He’s a great guy, but his fans are full Jeter at this point. He’ll stay, or he won’t, he’s earned the right to choose. He should do it with a different uniform on.

Troutstrikeout
Trusted Member
1 year ago

What did Ohtani do to you? You can barely stand him. It’s weird

Troutstrikeout
Trusted Member
1 year ago

Nah, your bar is pretty low. Not every seasons expectations are equal. If you got a bunch of players in their prime it’s time for that team to win. If it’s a young up and coming team like the 2014 astros 2022 orioles then .500 is awesome as they learn the league and how to win. With prime Rendon coming back from injury, who you seem to love, so that’s an addition to go with prime renfroe, and prime trout and prime Ohtani at the plate plus a good talented rookie in Neto and adding depth in urshela, and Walsh when he returns in the lineup to go with prime Ohtani and coming into their own Sandoval reid and FA Anderson in the pitching staff that’s a team that should make the playoffs with the expanded field. 2016-2021 we had no talent I didn’t expect anything but we actually have talent rn on this team yet the same losing mentality and mental mistakes.

gitchogritchoffmypettis
Legend
Reply to  Troutstrikeout

Jeez. I guess if you really really really need to be right about my low slung bar then all the sudden the team wasn’t really riddled with holes last year with the worst farm since the damming of the Tigris.

Here. “we actually have talent rn on this team yet the same losing mentality and mental mistakes….. on April 25th…. and we are 1 game under .500.”

You seem like the type of guy who has a shrine to Kobe Bryant in his house. Go meditate there for a while, think your mamba thoughts about bars and expectations and elevating. Come back in mid-June. If the team’s fallen apart we can hate it together and watch to see who we trade Ohtani to.

Troutstrikeout
Trusted Member
1 year ago

What’s with your barely concealed Ohtani hate. You can’t wait to hopefully win without him with the prospects we get and trouts 35-36.

gitchogritchoffmypettis
Legend
Reply to  Troutstrikeout

I love Ohtani. He’s fantastic and a cool dude. It’s the people who turn him into baseball’s Mehgan (spelling?) that I am tired of.

Troutstrikeout
Trusted Member
1 year ago

Idk who Meghan is but ok I get it, you don’t like people building him up so much. Ok

Troutstrikeout
Trusted Member
1 year ago

You’re always trying to emasculate him saying what’s his mommy think and other bs

Troutstrikeout
Trusted Member
1 year ago

I don’t really watch the nba anymore but kobe was a ball hog who never passed to Shaq as much as he should’ve when he was younger. He matured as he got older. Jordan was better than LeBron. That’s my nba take

MarineLayer
Super Member
1 year ago

All of this against an historical bad opponent. Impressive.

rosstrade
Trusted Member
1 year ago
Reply to  FungoAle

Hope you’re right.

Feels like we are just a few tweaks away from being much better.

Fansince1971
Legend
1 year ago

So….we all know the problem. It’s the same thing for many seasons. Anyone have a suggestion for a solution?

To me, immediately going to a 5 man rotation and moving Suarez to the bullpen is worth a shot. It’s unlikely they are going to DFA him. Suarez is 25 and inexpensive and was showing some promise going into the year.

IF someone needs to be DFA’d to create roster space, I would target Loup.

So it would be:

Ohtani
Sandoval
Detmers
Anderson
Canning

The bullpen OBVIOUSLY needs some help. Suarez provides more long relief like Barria.

Beyond that, I doubt a trade is possible at this time. Are there any free agents who could help the club? I know Zack Britton is out there but I would not go down that road.

Who can be elevated from the minors? And don’t say Joyce – that’s unrealistic.

I’d like to hear your ideas.

Twebur
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  Fansince1971

Does Perry have an exit strategy? Start calling up unproven young talent after getting rid of our roster trash? Are they smart enough to know if a some of our pitchers are ready? Or will it be shit thrown at the wall and see what sticks? How much of our 25 man roster is trash? Or is not developed properly? Or is it not well maintained, nobody smart enough to fix things. Sure looks like O’le Suarez was tipping pitches last night and not one motherF’er in our dugout sees it, or can correct it.

https://youtu.be/Q_h7JuqvDRs

Fansince1971
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  Twebur

Hilarious AD clip!

The pitch tipping thing – and more importantly the coaching staff not recognizing it – is 💯 embarrassing.

Cowboy26
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  Fansince1971

Apparently Nevin says this pitch tipping discovery story is fake news .

https://twitter.com/JeffFletcherOCR/status/1650994946177110016

So the train wreck continues…

Last edited 1 year ago by Cowboy26
Twebur
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  Cowboy26

I have a practical question. When did you find out Phillip?
Why did it take so long to either notice it, or fix it (if you’re not lying about knowing about it in the first place)? Because that was a violent shit load of hitting going on against him.

Dogface1956
Trusted Member
1 year ago
Reply to  Twebur

I think we need to find out what he knew, when he knew it, and what he did with the information he knew. Let’s take him to court and make him state the facts on the record. It could be a new episode of Law & Order the “Pitcher Rocked”, giving up one rocket after another, what did Phil know? Is ther a higher conspiracy maybe some trash cans getting beaten in the dugout, or was Trout an accomplice by somehow signaling the A’s dugout. Some how I’m sure Artie might be behind the whole thing

Last edited 1 year ago by Dogface1956
aces666high
Trusted Member
1 year ago
Reply to  Dogface1956

I’d watch that over an Angel game. Sounds more interesting and might have a happy ending every now and then.

Cowboy26
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  aces666high

Unfortunately I think this team already goes to court too much as it is.

aces666high
Trusted Member
1 year ago
Reply to  Cowboy26

Ugh, you’re not kidding

Twebur
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  Dogface1956

While we are investigating that, let’s probe into the urban legend of cow tipping.

And the magic loogie.
https://youtu.be/PA5HRW4DWz0

gitchogritchoffmypettis
Legend
Reply to  Twebur

My friends tried cow tipping. First, cows don’t sleep standing up apparently. Second, cows weigh a shit ton and don’t like falling over. I don’t think Khalil Mack can tip a cow.

aces666high
Trusted Member
1 year ago
Reply to  Cowboy26

I may be wrong but didn’t they say there was no tipping going on the last time this happened as well?

Cowboy26
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  aces666high

No tipping? Cheapskate Arte

aces666high
Trusted Member
1 year ago
Reply to  Cowboy26

Gotta save those shiny nickels for when it’s time to meddle w/signing free agents again!

Turk's Teeth
Editor
Super Member
1 year ago
Reply to  Fansince1971

Surprised that Anderson still has anyone’s confidence. His four seamer is averaging 89mph, while his flyball rate is at a career peak and hitters are making more hard contact – worst barrel rate in five years for him, worst hard hit % in his career. He’s missing few bats; his K%, never great, is at its nadir.

Perry brought him in for *three* years. But he already looks like a player approaching retirement. Reminds me of that year 33 season where Jered Weaver could no longer boot up the fog machine or tilt the mirrors just so to exceed his fundamentals.

I never really bought into the idea that his one-year transformation within the Dodgers org was sustainable or generalizable to the Angels org, but at present, he’s looking more like the fringe backender he was in ’19-’20 than an impact piece to a contending rotation.

Fansince1971
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  Turk's Teeth

I completely agree re Anderson. I expressed that concern from the day of the signing when others were swooning over the signing. But he’s signed for 3 years (uggh) and is in the rotation. So maybe he is the 5th starter?

Crcnme20
Member
1 year ago
Reply to  Fansince1971

This is definitely one of those things the Angels love to do – sign a guy based on one really strong year without looking at the body of work. Of course that doesn’t include Trout as I am talking about free agents. But Anderson fits right in with that practice and so far he has not looked anywhere close to how he did last season. With a 89 mph fastball that is not spotted well I am wondering how he was able to pull off such good numbers last season.

Fansince1971
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  Crcnme20

Yep – Anderson fits the mold. One good season in 6. Angels sign him after the anomaly.

One thing this team definitely does horribly is learn from prior mistakes.

Twebur
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  Fansince1971

No coincidence that it’s the Doyers that got that “One good season” out of him. I doubt the rumors that they wanted to even re-sign him. I thought Drive-Line was going to improve these clowns?

In all seriousness, can’t explain it, can’t point to something in particular, (I know, PROBABLY ARTE) this team is just cursed now. Must of sold our soul to the Baseball Devil to receive 2002 thru 2009.
Not much can be done with that.

Fansince1971
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  Twebur

This is the biggest reason why I feel it’s time for a rebuild. I seriously cannot put my finger on what is wrong with this organization. It’s so many things. For a team to have two MVPs in the prime of their career on the same team, and not be able to win consistently….it’s just unfathomable to me. It is either the worst luck or something systemic. I don’t really believe in bad luck so to me it has to be something systemic which means you got to tear it down and rebuild with players like Neto and O’Hoppe.

Cowboy26
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  Fansince1971

Did the Dodgers rebuild?

Fansince1971
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  Cowboy26

We are not the Dodgers.

Reminds me of the Dan Quayle debate.

I knew the Dodgers Org. I know the Dodgers Org. The Angels are not the Dodgers.

Guest
1 year ago
Reply to  Charles Sutton

Potatoe. There, I fixed it for you.

Cowboy26
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  Fansince1971

When then your mind is much more simplistic than I was giving you credit for.

In order for you to grasp this analogy, I will try to dumb it down for you. In order to predict the future you need to analyze the past. the Dodgers are one model of success that should be analyzed as should the other 28 organizations. A good organization will borrow and steal the positive elements of other successful ones. By lamely stating we are not the Doyers you are falling into the same trap as to fixate on the tired rebuild model that may or may not work someday.

Last edited 1 year ago by Cowboy26
Fansince1971
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  Cowboy26

Oh, I understood what you meant and I also stick to my statement. The Dodgers have been doing it right from the standpoint of drafting, developing players and international drafting for so long that it is part of their culture. The Angels don’t have the same culture and foundation so they can’t model themselves after something they are simply not.

No need to dumb things down – I knew where you were coming from. I just don’t think a team can model themselves after the Dodgers without having the infrastructure the Dodgers have in place.

The kind of rebuild I picture for the Angels is different than a complete teardown. I’m talking about trading what is tradable (like Ohtani) and getting as much young talent into the farm system as possible. This influx will mix with the current upcoming players, many of which are a year or two away.

Within two seasons, I believe we would have a young, exciting team which would still have veterans like Trout and Rendon. With the influx of young motivated talent, I believe we would see a more exciting product on the field and likely better results in the standings.

Last edited 1 year ago by Fansince1971
2GA2Join
Super Member
1 year ago
Reply to  Fansince1971

If things continue to go south, we can trade Ohtani and Renfroe and certainly get something back.
If Ward gets his trade value up a little, him too.
I suppose whatever we can get for Urshela too.

Cowboy26
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  Fansince1971

Within two seasons, I believe we would have a young, exciting team which would still have veterans like Trout and Rendon. With the influx of young motivated talent, I believe we would see a more exciting product on the field and likely better results in the standings.

Are you clueless? thats what we have now. We just haven’t seen the results yet.

What you describe is not a rebuild. But out of curiousity what would you be doing different now to effectuate your plan? ( Other than bitching and wailing and trading Ohtani at the last deadline of course)

Love to see your new fangled IIWPM ’71.

Fansince1971
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  Cowboy26

I already did an IIWPM pre-season. It involved trading Ohtani before the season. And if you keep resorting to name calling, I will not be responding to you anymore. Just because I’m not sitting in front of you doesn’t mean you shouldn’t be civilized.

Cowboy26
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  Fansince1971

Sorry to offend you. I’ll work on that. Unfortunately, this is my civilized behavior.

I guess I’ve never really thought of the term “clueless” as name calling but more of a state of being

Fansince1971
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  Cowboy26

I am not clueless nor do you have to dumb things down for me. We just disagree. I simply state where we disagree and why as opposed to calling you an idiot or saying “I’ll talk real slow”. There is no need for that.

You are convinced you know the answers and have insight that we should all read. I feel the same way. Just because the thoughts don’t always intersect doesn’t mean one of us is wrong or dumb or clueless.

There is plenty of room for many opinions and thought processes without such unnecessary additions. Just state your opinions and leave the side commentary out.

Last edited 1 year ago by Fansince1971
Cowboy26
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  Fansince1971

Great well then maybe next time you wont be compelled to reference disjointed and unrelated analogies like the Dan Quayle reference (unless you were actually trying to go all Lloyd Bentsen on me) .

Fansince1971
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  Cowboy26

Cowboy- You remind me of every bully I have ever met. Cannot take ownership and blaming others. A simple acknowledgment of the unnecessary personal attacks would have sufficed. Instead you find it necessary to rationalize.

Okay – sounds good. I’m sorry for the Dan Quayle analogy. It certainly justified your needlessly calling me clueless, simple and asserting things have to be dumbed down. Yes that makes perfect and logical sense now. Thank you for that clarification.

I don’t like bullies and have spent my career defending those who have been bullied.

aces666high
Trusted Member
1 year ago
Reply to  Fansince1971

I liked the Danny boy blast from the past. Simpler times..

Cowboy26
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  Fansince1971

Whew. I’m glad we got that little therapy session out of the way.

I’ve Never been called a bully before . Pretentious maybe but not a bully.

But I still dont really understand your people interaction skills where you claim you’re offended by name calling but then subtly call those that dont’ share your vision names or saddle them with derogatory references. Seems a little too hypocritical don’t you think?

aces666high
Trusted Member
1 year ago
Reply to  Cowboy26

I know right? Who wouldn’t love being called clueless???

Buncha savages!

gitchogritchoffmypettis
Legend
Reply to  Fansince1971

BURN IT ALL! Let’s do it. 50M payroll baby! Top 5 draft picks! Let’s roll.

max
Trusted Member
max
1 year ago
Reply to  Fansince1971

“One thing this team definitely does horribly is learn from prior mistakes.” This is the truth, since free agency started in the seventies, with rare exception

Turk's Teeth
Editor
Super Member
1 year ago
Reply to  Fansince1971

Or maybe they’re going to have to cut bait, and sink or swim with Silseth.

Silseth actually has two plus secondaries and when his 4SFB is at 94-95 instead of 92-94, his five pitch mix generates a lot of missed bats. He’s only 22, he needs extension and repetition – location and the third time through the order are his hurdles right now, but the upside is miles above Anderson.

Last edited 1 year ago by Turk's Teeth
Fansince1971
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  Turk's Teeth

That might be an early hook. Not saying I wouldn’t consider it and I was not a fan of the signing at all. But I doubt they will throw him in the trash that quickly.

gitchogritchoffmypettis
Legend
Reply to  Fansince1971

Well, he IS a 4th type starter. He’s only getting 13M a year. But he just looks BAD. I wasn’t expecting Dodgers Anderson, just like I’ve never expected Loup’s last season with the Mets (and no, Loup’s also not getting paid as if that season was real either). But I had hoped for the Pirates version of Anderson, but he’s got problems at this point.

MarineLayer
Super Member
1 year ago
Reply to  Turk's Teeth

The Angels strategy seems to be pay for the career year of a declining player with a long-term contract. If we’re lucky, it’s only for a year or two of said declining player.

Jeff Joiner
Editor
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  Turk's Teeth

I fully expected him to regress to a mid to back end of the rotation guy. 6 innings of league average ball to save the bullpen a bit. Consistency not excellence.

In short, I expected meh to decent and we’ve gotten the usual crap.

Twebur
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  Fansince1971

Throw Tucker D in the starting rotation, find out if he has something, or is it just a mirage. So far with his limited success this ST and early season, worth a shot, probably going to get a better result than having Suarez embarrass himself. If Anderson continues to struggle, find a mystery back issue, buy some time to see if he’s fixable. Just don’t give him until June to figure it out.

Cowboy26
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  Fansince1971

The unicorn aint pitching in a 5 man rotation and we are only using a 6 man when there are no off days to skip this spot.

Suarez is out of options. So is Tucky D so they will switch these 2 out for the 6 man spot and Suarez will get the mop.

There are only 2 pitchers in the bullpen with options Warren & Wantz. ( And only one when tepoopa comes back) Wantz aint going anywhere while Warren (who took Herget’s spot) has dumped a little accelerant on the fire every time hes come in this year . He is odd man out

So Stupid Phil was not the problem with the pen last night . It was Stupid Perry. he built this pen and as Fletch states below their options were very limited. But knowing Suarez was a walking dumpster fire on a precarious ledge, I’m shocked the Angels wouldn’t have optioned Warren for a fresh arm from the Great Salt Lake so we didnt have to sit there last night and endure meat pitch home runs over and over and over and over and over again

Fansince1971
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  Cowboy26

If the unicorn requires a six man rotation, then what you have suggested, makes sense.

I also agree that in a critical year (for many reasons and one that the Org itself had to be a winner), there was a lot of reliance put on an unproven bullpen and the signing of a starting pitcher who had one good year out of 6.

gitchogritchoffmypettis
Legend
Reply to  Fansince1971

Sigh… Anderson has been solid a lot more than one season. Not GOOD, but solid, which is about where he’s also getting paid. Have no idea what his issue is right now, but they need to get him back up to a 95-110 ERA+ guy.

Crcnme20
Member
1 year ago

If I had to guess with respect to Anderson I would think its a location problem. If his fastball tops out at 89 (I don’t know if that’s the case, I only watched him live opening weekend and he was at 88 pretty consistently) then that leads me to believe the only way he succeeds is through location and deception. Obviously he is no Greg Maddux but he has been successful in the past while throwing the speeds he does now. Hopefully he makes the adjustments and gives us a bit more than he has so far.

Side note – isn’t it crazy baseball salaries have gotten so out of hand that 13 million a year leads us to expect nothing better than average. Never thought I would see that day.

gitchogritchoffmypettis
Legend
Reply to  Crcnme20

Anderson never had a fastball. Trouble is, none of his other pitches are fooling anyone right now.

JackFrost
Super Member
1 year ago
Reply to  Cowboy26

Yeah, Perry did fail at his job. But last night it was STILL stupid Phil. He failed to use Davidson earlier and stop the bleeding, AND he did not use Estevez OR Quintana at all... Either one of those two likely closes the game in the 9th and we get the W. That’s on Phil my friend …

Last edited 1 year ago by JackFrost
Cowboy26
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  JackFrost

He couldn’t use Davidson earlier. Davidson was pitching on 3 days rest with not alot of options to pull out Suarez in the second inning. Thats the whole point Frostie. So if your complaint was leaving him in for Inning 3 then how do you explain Suarez success in innings 4 & 5? We had no-one to pitch innings 3, 4 & 5 because Perry tied Nevins hands with the bullpen limitations.

gitchogritchoffmypettis
Legend
Reply to  Cowboy26

I don’t think there are many teams that can handle a string of starts like we’ve had from our rotation the last week or so and not suffer pretty bad bullpen exhaustion. I mean, how many teams have that #6 guy in the pen who is really good? Last night was more a result of the last several games. Having Jhonny Diaz around instead of Warren for a night promises nothing.

Cowboy26
Legend
1 year ago

other than Johnny Diaz would be available to pitch the third inning when no-one else was.

JackFrost
Super Member
1 year ago
Reply to  Cowboy26

Well, hindsight is 20/20, but now we know that Suarez was tipping his pitches… If it was corrected one could justify keeping him in longer. However, we don’t know what inning Shohei caught that and pointed it out to Phil — maybe he noticed it and wanted to wait a few more batters for confirmation etc.. In any case, I don’t agree about Davidson. I mean, 3 days rest seems adequate for a middle-relief guy if your plan is to pitch him 4 innings. Two days no, but three days yes. That is my feeling.

As far as we know he’s not dealing with any health or injury issues.. In general I do agree with the line of thought that says a GM who fails to assemble a quality pen is tying the managers hands. But that holds more for a long stretch of games or the whole season … For an INDIVIDUAL game (like last night) a manager CAN blow it and Phil did just that.

BTW, how do you rationalize keeping Wantz in to close esp. when he’s normally a 1 inning guy? Or the larger point of not using Estevez or Q ? How do you defend that stupidity by Phil ??

Last edited 1 year ago by JackFrost
AnAngelsFan
Super Member
1 year ago
Reply to  JackFrost

Are you sure Perry didn’t give restrictions to Phil on which relievers were available? That’s one of the things that Maddon complained about.

Cowboy26
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  AnAngelsFan

He did. that was pretty apparent from the Jeff Fletcher story.

JackFrost
Super Member
1 year ago
Reply to  AnAngelsFan

Well, this is a good point, and I have in fact made it elsewhere. I posted a comment yesterday where I mentioned this as a possibility. IF it is in fact true, then of course Phil is off the hook for that nonsense last night.

And by extension Perry looks like a complete and total idiot.

Last edited 1 year ago by JackFrost
aces666high
Trusted Member
1 year ago
Reply to  AnAngelsFan

Isn’t it awesome that the GM was dictating to the manager what to do? I mean ol Joe wasn’t good but a coach being told what to do by a guy in a box seat doesn’t work.

Much easier to do w/interm Nevin. He’ll do as he’s told.

gitchogritchoffmypettis
Legend
Reply to  aces666high

I love how this whole threat to aged manhood that Maddon symbolizes has grown into “Perry was always calling him and telling him exactly what to do during games.” It’s cute, like college chicks gossiping at a cafeteria table…. but with way more saggy boobs.

aces666high
Trusted Member
1 year ago

You’re right. It probably only happened once.

gitchogritchoffmypettis
Legend
Reply to  Fansince1971

It’s been about a month, so decisions are gonna come down the line.

I am a big fan of the 5 man rotation idea because we can never get six quality starts in a row. That rotation you listed looks as good as we can get to me, though Turks mentioned below, some sort of coaching intervention needs to happen with Anderson. But it’s a positive idea, and it wouldn’t be set in stone, if a gap start is needed we can throw Davidson or an MiLB arm in there when needed. Will they do it? Probably not. Moving Suarez to the pen in favor of Canning may actually help though.

I’d replace Lamb with Cabbage, as has been suggested. If for no other reason, for enthusiasm. Combine that with Neto’s effect. Maybe Querro down the line if he keeps murdering AA. That enthusiasm, combined with guys like Trout and the veterans who are healthy, could actually be some good chemistry. Walsh returning will also elevate the mood a good bit.

As for MiLB pitching, right now you’d have to pick your poison. Rosenburg maybe? Diaz? Devinski, Webb, Garza? Maybe Torres, Yovan or Ingram from AA? Total crap shoot. In the pen, which horse do you shoot? I mean, you only have Loup as a permanent seething target left. Barria? Otherwise it’s some fairly solid arms that screwed the pooch recently.

I think the weird fear of letting the fat Latino soft tossers leave is kind of a burden, not an asset. If any of the AAA arms other than Warren were killing it this would annoy me.

If I were calling guys into my office heading into May it would be Lamb, Rengifo (who will go crush it on another team as soon as he gets away from Sad Donkey JuJu), Loup, Suarez, Barria… I’m not a child and this isn’t my first season watching baseball so I know they can’t “just DFA them” but Suarez to the pen, Lamb DFA, maybe start letting some right handers work more against lefty batters to show Loup we are investigating platoon splits, go to a 5 man rotation with Davidson spot starting, tell the rest of the losers that they need to get working or they’ll get moving as soon as options present themselves…

See if that does anything. I think this is realistically what they can do. I think even the demotion of Suarez would warn the rest of our pitchers. Pretty much only Anderson is safe.

Fansince1971
Legend
1 year ago

Really good analysis. Thanks for this. It takes my thought process one step further. At this point, I really don’t think they have anything to lose.

MarineLayer
Super Member
1 year ago
Reply to  Fansince1971

Better players. Better coaching. Better roster management. Unfortunately, none of this is in the cards.

Cowboy26
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  MarineLayer

Better ingredients & Better Pizza too?

gitchogritchoffmypettis
Legend
Reply to  Cowboy26

The key is to just hate your team a little harder. Then it’ll change. This same method also works with wives, children, pets, cars…..

Twebur
Legend
1 year ago

I will increase my self-loathing. Along with my hate for my teams.

smithy610
Super Member
1 year ago

Fletcher gets into the heart of the bullpen problem:

Honestly, the problem is not using the relievers too much or protecting them too much.

It’s not having enough decent relievers out of their own farm system, who can be optioned when they need a break and who need fewer breaks because they’re young.

That is the issue

Last edited 1 year ago by smithy610
FungoAle
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  smithy610

Lack of talent is the problem? From reading the other posts from the past week, it’s Phil’s Phault.

Twebur
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  FungoAle

I’ll post this again

campanis.wav – Tommy Lasorda on whose fault it is: “Ain’t my f***ing fault? Campanis is the f***ing guy.” 

MarineLayer
Super Member
1 year ago
Reply to  smithy610

Without options, there is very little flexibility. Minisian’s bullpen construction has been disastrous, and Nevin’s decision making takes a bad situation and makes it worse.

Fansince1971
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  MarineLayer

Are there any decent arms out there that could be signed as a free agent to try to help the bullpen?

Last edited 1 year ago by Fansince1971
Senator_John_Blutarsky
Legend
Reply to  smithy610

Wait…what…talent matters?

Perry overpaid on Tempura and Loop, and drafted 20 pitchers – and things didn’t work out?

Crcnme20
Member
1 year ago

I have been thinking about the biggest issue we have in Anaheim and really the most difficult part of it all is it is going to take major steps to correct the issues that have come about. To keep this short we really only need to look at the 2002-2009 years to see why the team lacks success now. The 2002 team was made up of players we developed in house who turned into very good baseball players on the field. From Erstad to Salmon to K-Rod to Lackey the Angels development was strong. The Angels developmental system at the time was one of the best in baseball.

The following years (after the World Series in 2002) we went out and added a few big contracts such as Guerrero and so on, but that was not how we fixed any issues. We developed players and molded them with a few big veterans to bolster the team as a whole.

Fast forward to today – how often do we call up a player who shines immediately? How often does the font office instead try to keep things patched together by throwing tons of money at a veteran who more often than not underperforms for us? Really the fix is simple, it just wont happen. We have to get back to that formula that led us to all those division titles between 2000-2010: player development. Until the organization develops better, this will be a fight annually for the team and the fans will have to continue to endure one crummy season after another.

Fansince1971
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  Crcnme20

I would respond that right now Neto and O’Hoppe show great promise. Add in Detmers and even Canning.

I am hoping for a youth movement myself and believe there are some pieces on the Farm that will greatly contribute in the next couple years.

The problem is that there really aren’t any arms available at this moment to help with the current situation. In a year I expect there will be several.

All of this is to say that I think we are at the cusp of a productive farm that is arguably already paying dividends. My vote is for a youth movement- trading Ohtani and anyone else that can return legit prospects and begin the rebuild. I find no pleasure watching this team underperform year after year.

Crcnme20
Member
1 year ago
Reply to  Fansince1971

Yeah, I think the reality of this entire situation is we probably have to trade Ohtani for whatever we can get because the make up of the current team is not going to lead to wins. We have far too much money dedicated to too few players and it’s definitely showing on the field especially on the mound.

Fansince1971
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  Crcnme20

Agreed. It’s time to rebuild.

Cowboy26
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  Fansince1971

No thanks

Fansince1971
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  Cowboy26

How can you not rebuild? There’s just nothing in the system that is going to allow for this team success for probably two or three years at a minimum.

Aren’t you tired of watching the same season over and over again?

Cowboy26
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  Fansince1971

What is this magic rebuild pixie dust that you so blindly long for? Arent we essentially rebuilding now? We drafted a shortstop last year who is in our starting lineup. We traded for a AA catcher at the trade deadline who was our primary starter until he got injured last week.( But wait injuries wouldn’t happen if we tore this sucker down now would they?) Our third best pitcher was our 2020 draft choice. Look at the service time of Sandoval, Suarez, Canning & Davidson.Arent those the type of pitchers that would be part of a rebuild?

Every winning team needs a mixture of vets and youngsters. Look at the 2002 roster and tell me how many years it took that team to reach its pinnacle and how that team was built.
Your delusion that tearing this thing down is somehow a panacea is asinine.

gitchogritchoffmypettis
Legend
Reply to  Fansince1971

I am tired of watching people complain about watching the same season in April of a season so I am all for lighting it all on fire. I want to watch everyone watch a team where the best player is Jed Lowrie for a couple years.

Fansince1971
Legend
1 year ago

Well we are certainly seeing similar problems from prior seasons. Could that all change – sure hope so.

My idea of a rim job is not a complete burn down at the house. I don’t think that’s even possible because you can’t get rid of ringtone or Trout meaningfully. It would be more about resigning yourself that Ohtani is gone, training him for as much talent as you can get and may be trading a few other people who have value, including possibly Ward.

Then you bring up the young guys and let them play with the veterans. The roster gets younger and hungrier and likely more exciting to watch.

DowningDude
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  Fansince1971

Ringtones are actually USEFUL. Rendon is not

Twebur
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  DowningDude

I’ll take Ringtones and Rim Jobs for $1000 Alex.

My idea of a rim job is

We might have a different definition for that term.

aces666high
Trusted Member
1 year ago
Reply to  DowningDude

Run to the Hills, Number of the Beast and Can I Play With Madness all used to tell me when my wife was calling so yes ringtones were very useful.

Oft injured, .230 hitting 3B’s are not. You’re 100% correct.

My wife was not amused btw.

Cowboy26
Legend
1 year ago

Or Eric Sogard. We can be Team Czechoslovakia! they got points for being gutty and fun to watch didn’t they?

aces666high
Trusted Member
1 year ago

I’m tired of you complaining about the complaints.

But I agree, burn it to the ground. I want to see ads for the local hardware store superimposed on the padding because all the big boys ran.

Fansince1971
Legend
1 year ago

Wait a second- way too early to say the 20 pitcher draft didn’t work out. At least 2 more seasons to go on that analysis.

But Tempura and Loopy I agree.

Last edited 1 year ago by Fansince1971
BannedInLA
Super Member
1 year ago

Last evenings 1-6 stink bomb notwithstanding, I’d like to see Trout moved into the leadoff spot – at least for a spell.

Ward is is struggling. Period.

Trout, even when struggling, takes a lot of pitches, has power, runs well, etc. Think Justin Upton a few years back.

Trout
Ohtani
Rendon
Renfroe
Ward
Urshela
Drury
Wallch/Thaiss
Neto

I like Neto in the 9 hole for now.

MarineLayer
Super Member
1 year ago
Reply to  BannedInLA

Rendon hitting cleanup makes zero sense. No power, no protection for Trout and Shohei.

BannedInLA
Super Member
1 year ago
Reply to  MarineLayer

Rendon would hit 3rd, for now, in my suggested lineup above. The power should come back at some point, but he’s still a solid run producer with guys on base.

Look at his current RBI vs. AB numbers – better than TroutTani thus far.

HalosFanForLife
Trusted Member
1 year ago

If they rank players on 20-80 scale, what is Rengifo’s grade on baseball IQ?

steelgolf
Super Member
1 year ago

9

GrandpaBaseball
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  steelgolf

Generous this morning.

Crcnme20
Member
1 year ago
Reply to  steelgolf

One has to wonder what in the holy hell he was thinking going for two in that situation. That was to say the least a horrible decision.

AnAngelsFan
Super Member
1 year ago
Reply to  Crcnme20

He was thinking “We might lose because I made a stupid decision to throw to 3B last half inning so I absolutely have to make up for that mistake by getting to 2B.”

DowningDude
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  AnAngelsFan

🎯

Crcnme20
Member
1 year ago
Reply to  DowningDude

Probably right on that one. i kind of felt like getting a hit in that situation was a good start to making up for his mistake prior, but I guess he didn’t feel that way.

aces666high
Trusted Member
1 year ago
Reply to  Crcnme20

Langston said if he had made the decision to go for two right away he would have made it. Instead he slowed down rounding first and was thrown out.

Mark and Terry was pretty peeved about it. They brought it up multiple times between pitches and as the inning progressed.

HalosFanForLife
Trusted Member
1 year ago
Reply to  aces666high

I think he’s still out if he is going the whole way, that’s how out he was. The throw to third. Bad. Cutting off the double play by inserting himself in the throwing lane. WTF.

HalosFanForLife
Trusted Member
1 year ago
Reply to  steelgolf

Pujols’s speed tool over his last 5 years would have a higher grade than Rengifo’s baseball IQ ranking.

toad2065
Trusted Member
1 year ago

The organization has a huge blind spot. Years have been spent trying to turn him into a serviceable player, but he just isn’t. Guaranteed to wilt under pressure and fail to make routine plays too frequently. He’s a complete waste of a roster spot!

Guest
1 year ago

Enter your caption for this photo from last night’s game!

comment image

Senator_John_Blutarsky
Legend
Reply to 

Loser. Couldn’t hit a home run.

GrandpaBaseball
Legend
1 year ago

Checking our baseball cards for stat blunders.

Twebur
Legend
1 year ago

Checking cell phones for end of world EMERGENCY ALERT SYSTEM going off.

THIS IS NOT A TEST!!!!!!
https://youtu.be/2lgwnP8lmNA

tanana40
Super Member
1 year ago
Reply to 

What does my defense card say to do when the starting pitcher is throwing gopher balls?

Fansince1971
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to 

“Our bullpen is worse than yours!”

fishfarm
Trusted Member
1 year ago
Reply to 

Time to get the leader in analysis and therapy on the line to fix this train wreck!

comment image

Last edited 1 year ago by fishfarm
Twebur
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  fishfarm

Depessed angel fan support group. 

“I’m afraid I just blue myself.”
https://youtu.be/9GYtgFdXCGE

Fansince1971
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  fishfarm

Team-o-cil!!

HalosFanForLife
Trusted Member
1 year ago

I have been a Suarez fan, but this is ridiculous. It’s like teams are taking batting practice on him right now. Our minor league pitching development or talent evaluation needs a total overhaul. Maybe both. Two predominantly pitcher-focused drafts, and we’re still horribly mediocre on the bump with our homegrowns. Our drafted guys in the pitching mix are so underwhelming. It’s pathetic.

MarineLayer
Super Member
1 year ago

And we sign free agents like Anderson after career years, and they start sucking almost immediately after arrival.

smithy610
Super Member
1 year ago

Last night’s loss was so frustrating. You’d think that a middle-of-the-pack Angels team, once they got the lead against the worst team in the league, would be able to hold onto it. They weren’t playing against the Yankees, or Astros or Rays, whose ability to come back from behind isn’t out of the question.

This is especially infuriating. From the MLB recap:

But they couldn’t hold a one-run lead in the ninth, as they blew their Major League-leading seventh save in an 11-10 loss in 10 innings to the last-place A’s

Convert even just half of those saves and they’re right on TX’s heels.

The Angels have had the lead in 20 of their 23 games this season but fell to 11-12 on the year, as they’ve had trouble finishing off games.

Yeah, yeah, bullpen stats don’t seem bad – ERA, whatever else – but the above aren’t good either.

Fansince1971
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  smithy610

Same thing every year. It’s deja vu.

MarineLayer
Super Member
1 year ago
Reply to  smithy610

Minasian has moved a few defective deck chairs around the Titanic with predictable results.

Guest
1 year ago

At least Trout has improved from striking out with the game on the line to putting the ball in play! What a crazy string of unproductive outs in high leverage situations Trout is on right now.

DowningDude
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to 

Baby steps

Guest
1 year ago

Jo Adell is a hard worker and seems like a nice guy, but what would the Angels’ record be right now if his defense was out in left field instead of Taylor Ward’s?

Senator_John_Blutarsky
Legend
Reply to 

11-12?

Guest
1 year ago

The Hyundai key to the game for the Halos tonight is “That’s Life” by David Lee Roth.

After last night’s game where we are out of it right from the beginning, then use the bottom half of our lineup for a crazy come back only to give up the ghost again in the late innings and then have a final comeback fall just short, don’t worry Angels, that’s life.

It looks like a grand slam is going to sink us but then Taylor “Superman” Ward swoops in for the leaping catch to save the day, that’s life.

Mike Trout up for the walk-off in extra innings only to hit a grounder to end the game, that’s life.

EACH TIME THAT I FIND MYSELF
FLAT ON MY FACE
I PICK MYSELF UP
AND GET BACK IN THE RACE!

We’ve got Canning/Sandoval/Ohtani on the docket. We’re taking three of four.

https://youtu.be/Lf6ao8cvyoU

BannedInLA
Super Member
1 year ago
Reply to 

`Keep the positive vibes flowin’ dude. I like it.

steelgolf
Super Member
1 year ago

6:07 am and still no word about a Suarez DFA.

ihearhowie3.0
Super Member
1 year ago
Reply to  steelgolf

Feels like a guy that another team would fix pretty quickly given some recent success. More likely they fear that embarrassment and just have him join Barria as another failed starter/long reliever mop.

Maybe he will work his way into blowing some saves in a year or two like Jaime.

steelgolf
Super Member
1 year ago
Reply to  ihearhowie3.0

I wish another team would try to fix him.

Fansince1971
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  steelgolf

Suarez is unlikely to be DFA’d. He’s 25, healthy, cheap and has pitched well going into this season. Perry would DFA Loup before Suarez if there was need for space on the roster. No way Suarez makes it through waivers.

Last edited 1 year ago by Fansince1971
steelgolf
Super Member
1 year ago
Reply to  Fansince1971

I wouldn’t mi d if they DFA both!

gitchogritchoffmypettis
Legend
Reply to  Fansince1971

Loup’s gotta be on his last chance about now. Trouble is, who am excited about replacing him with?

Fansince1971
Legend
1 year ago

Precisely

steelgolf
Super Member
1 year ago
Reply to  steelgolf

6:35 pm and still Suarez has not been DFA’d