LA Angels Weekend News Crash: Holiday Shopping

The holiday season is definitely upon us and MLB teams are acting just like the rest of us by buying things on their wish lists.

We’d like to wish a Happy Hannukah to all who celebrate starting Sunday. May you spend your eight days of celebration with family, friends, and all that great food.

And take a look at the substantial list of current and former ballplayers of Jewish descent. I hadn’t seen that site before, something tells me I’m going to nerd out and learn something new and link it in the future.

Back to the holiday shopping thing. Nobody broke out the Amex Black Card like the SF Giants this week. Carlos Correa’s mega deal stole the headlines but they also added Sean Manea and Ross Stripling on identical 2 year $25 million deals.

Add in Mitch Haniger going to his hometown Giants and SF spent a cool $423,500,000 dollars in the last few weeks.

This on top of the Padres dropping huge coin on Xander Bogaerts and trying to give huge coin to everybody else and the NL West is looking like the old AL East when it comes to payroll and free agent signings.

The Padres will certainly look to shake up their lineup this year and could be making more moves.

Meanwhile the Dodgers are oddly silent thus far. They did sign Thor to a one year deal yesterday. So basically Tyler Anderson and Thor have swapped teams and will make nearly identical base salaries. It will be interesting to see which LA squad gets the better deal here.

The Dodgers did add J.P. Feyersian which might be a perfect fit for both sides.

It was a good day to be a former Angels hurler. Michael Lorenzen got $8.5 million to head to Detroit who also signed Matthew Boyd yesterday.

For the first time in forever I saw two pieces of an Angels team leave and didn’t think we’d really miss them. We also saw two pieces of the Angels rotation sign for solid money. Neither of which has happened in forever.

All these signings pretty much left Dansby Swanson and Carlos Rodon as prettiest girls still at the dance. MLBTR looked for the best landing spots for Swanson. As for Rodon, he signed with the Yankees last night.

ESPN goes way out on a limb when looking at the Judge, Turner, and Xander contracts. Paying these guys through their 30s might be a risky idea.

FanGraphs took a good look at why teams are issuing extremely long contracts. It is a nice piece of financial literacy applied to the MLB market. Not as much fun as your normal longform, nor quite as long, but digest this with some coffee.

If finance isn’t your gig, try wrapping your head around the large and complex Sean Murphy trade that went down. I still don’t get it from the Braves perspective and think the Brewers did well here, but what do I know?

I think the Angels are done with core moves and will look to find bargain depth when they can. With that in mind I took a stab at some mid tier free agents who would really help flesh out the roster.

There really wasn’t a lot of Angels news this week. The team did hire a new hitting coach for Salt Lake. And the baseball media is considering it a given Ohtani leaves Anaheim.

Meanwhile no news on the sale of the franchise.

And as we head into this holiday season, don’t forget about that super special holiday on February 14th. You know, the one where pitchers and catchers officially report to Spring Training.

Here’s a nice site to use to plan a trip. Not only does it contain the entire Cactus League schedule, it has a convenient map of all the stadiums and a trip planner feature which will help you catch the teams you want to watch.

I also like this site, which adds the WBC exhibitions to the game schedule.

I have my flights, car, and AirBnB booked. Going to meet my dad like usual and we have close friends joining us for their first Spring Training trip. I’m already looking forward to afternoons in the sun watching baseball.

Have a great weekend and link anything I missed.

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HalosFanForLife
Trusted Member
1 year ago

Brantley back to Astros.

Mia
Legend
Mia
1 year ago

Justin Turner to the Red Sox was not on my Bingo card….

Cowboy26
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  Mia

2 for $22M seems like an expensive buy in for that Bingo game.

But I guess its the new price normal.

gitchogritchoffmypettis
Legend
Reply to  Jeff Joiner

Man, the Sox are weird. The Blue Jays used to weird me out the most as a franchise. People don’t realize that Rogers Mega Co is a friggin HUGE company and the Blue Jays could, if they wanted, carry a 300M payroll.

You can also check and see, they receive $0.00 from a TV contract. Why? Rogers owns the network they are on…. not an RSM, a national TV network. There are big piles of Jays fans in Winnipeg, Calgary even Vancouver. The Jays have crazy fanbase, marketing and revenue generation yet they act like they are the Seattle Mariners.

But WTF are the Red Sox doing? Constant “being in” on guys, signing just about nothing, etc? They already reset their cap I think. They seem to be planning to rebuild as contracts like Sale come off the books but they just won’t admit that guys like Bogarts and Devers will probably not get signed to huge contracts. How much FTX stock did the Henries have?

Cowboy26
Legend
1 year ago

Dombrowski convinced them to spend big when he was there just like he’s done with the Phillies now.

When they hired Chaim I thought they would start routinely churning out above average role players and pitchers while still signing big time free agents. Instead they have let all their great players leave via free agency while downgrading their roster with their replacements.

Time will tell as this is a franchise that won 4 World Series championships in 15 years but it certainly doesn’t operate like it used to.

FungoAle
Legend
1 year ago

If Bloom loses Devers, don’t think he survives.

JackFrost
Super Member
1 year ago
Reply to  FungoAle

The marching orders are clearly coming from ownership. That said, the Massholes are in an uproar over Bogaerts. Somebody will have to get axed if Devers walks as well…

Mia
Legend
Mia
1 year ago
Reply to  Jeff Joiner

Imagine listening to that drunk Boston crowd booing him most nights.

gitchogritchoffmypettis
Legend
Reply to  Jeff Joiner

Yeah. Stupid Red Sox fans. A guy has a couple bad weeks, or gets injured or what ever and they just want to trash him and throw him aside. Hell the mere mention of his name drives some of them to flared nostrils and angry babel. Then they just demand their owner toss aside said player and buy a free agent to fill the void as though that can easily be done with five or six players in a season. If the team ever wants to take a while and see if any of these players can actually get on track and provide value those jerk fans just yell and scream about not caring about winning.

Those types of fans are stupid assholes. Man do we hate those types around here.

Angelz4ever
Super Member
1 year ago

Just to let you guys know, Seth Lugo is drawing my interest.

Cowboy26
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  Angelz4ever

Now that its down to the Doyers and the Friars to sign him, I could care less if he was drawing flies

2002heaven
Super Member
1 year ago

comment image
Why not, now that they signed Trea Turner?
https://youtu.be/-G_3eWoz2s4
💪 💪 💪 BYE!!!!!

Last edited 1 year ago by 2002heaven
gitchogritchoffmypettis
Legend
Reply to  2002heaven

Yeah. I was wondering if they plan to keep him. They could, and play Turner in the OF since they have Marsh and two piles of mush out there now.

GrandpaBaseball
Legend
1 year ago

In the last 2 off seasons the market for good players has shown that the demand exceeds the supply. J.D. Martinez is not going to get 500 AB’s, he’s 37 years old and he signed for 10 million a year. The marketplace for catchers and shortstops, pitchers and centerfielders has proven expensive, but it still is the market price. For the Angels to compete for a wild card spot, the teams very much needs to purchase their players because of 20 years of mismanagement. So yes, we should have signed a SS and 2 starting pitchers at market value.

Some chose to look at the Angels as a mid-market team because home is in Anaheim. Phooey. The market is Southern California, period. The Angels don’t market in the SF Valley or Inland Empire. Rams have their team’s name everywhere, involvement in everything they can be involved in, is that the case with the Halos? (Yes, I believe that maybe they become the Southern California Angeles. SoCalAngels?). They are big market, time to act like it.

You may think that Correa and Swanson and Turner signed for a lot of dough, and they did. But will the teams that paid big money for players do better? Forget for a moment about the money, would have a good hitting and fantastic glove SS helped the team win in ’23? Now let’s talk money. If normal teams’ employee a front office of 55 and we are at 43, does that cut out a lot of payroll? If we have 3-4 less coaches on minor league teams cut payroll? How about the salary of our GM, asst. GM, etc. Does Nevin make anywhere close to what Joe made? If this team was to really want to compete it would have. Stop thinking that the team and Arte are strapped, never has that been the case. Buy big names and they will come worked for 19 years while money buy the bucket loaded was taken out of this team.

The new owners will come in and make money, a lot of money.

MarineLayer
Super Member
1 year ago

Just a small nit to pick, about 70% of the fans in attendance at recent Rams “home games” were fans of the Santa Clara and former Oakland franchises. Marketing the Angels is an area where the Doyers rule the roost is challenging. Arturo has clearly not risen to that challenge. Let’s hope his successor does better.

gitchogritchoffmypettis
Legend

No. No they shouldn’t. We should accept the fact that we will have to wade through some uncertainty and possibly more crap and eventually build a team that is cheaper and younger with a farm system behind it. Then extend those cheap young players earlier and cheaper.

HalosFanForLife
Trusted Member
1 year ago

How about Ohtani & Rengifo for Hoerner, Madrigal and Steele. Unless the new owner coming in is a Steve Cohen type of guy, we can’t keep Ohtani. We need to move now as we simply don’t have enough for this year without a lot of luck and 2 or 3 breakthrough performers. I see us fighting for 3rd in the AL West if we remain healthy. Then go pick up Brantley as a DH.

Cowboy26
Legend
1 year ago

Why wouldn’t the new owner coming in NOT be a “Steve Cohen type”?

The sales price will more than likely top $3,000,000,000. Far and away the largest amount ever paid for a MLB franchise. You think that the new owner after writing that check will resort to penny pinching or regression analysis rationality by letting the most Unique player in baseball history walk without making him a record contract offer?

The question is not “if” but “when?” will the New owner will take control of the ballplayer and try and retain the unicorn.

HalosFanForLife
Trusted Member
1 year ago
Reply to  Cowboy26

It’s possible. My prediction has been that the new owner will likely be a Japanese buyer. A buyer like Yomiuri Shimbun Holdings could be the blessing to bring us Cohen like money as they could monetize Japan like nobody else. If it’s a domestic buyer, we definitely need that unicorn.

Last edited 1 year ago by HalosFanForLife
gitchogritchoffmypettis
Legend
Reply to  Cowboy26

Yes. I totally think the new owner is capable of not paying Ohtani way too much money to get old on our teams dime. Not saying it will happen, but it’s totally a possibility.

FungoAle
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  Jeff Joiner

Good on Lugo but another lefty starter is not my preference. Perry busy playing small ball again.

Angelstan
Trusted Member
1 year ago
Reply to  FungoAle

Per MLBTR, Lugo is down to Dodgers and Padres or maybe Nationals. Not Angels.

FungoAle
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  Angelstan

Yikes, that closes the door on Lugo. That’s ok. His best days are behind him but a good pitcher.

Eric_in_Portland
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  Jeff Joiner

I sure don’t want Davidson in the rotation.

Meanwhile, since Swanson is the new Cub SS, would Hoerner be available?

FungoAle
Legend
1 year ago

Miso Horner would be nice but Cubs will likely plant him at 2nd

2002heaven
Super Member
1 year ago

Only $4M more than we overpaid for Thor last year who only pitched 2in in 2021. Meanwhile the stupid Dodgers got him for 1/2 of what we paid him a year ago. STUPID DODGERS, IF THEY WERE REALLY SMART LIKE US,THEY WOULD HAVE GAVE HIM A 7YR DEAL FOE $30M A YEAR……
 💪 

Angelstan
Trusted Member
1 year ago
Reply to  Jeff Joiner

The interest in Hill tells me they are back at the bargain basement and/or trying to get guys that likely won’t work out for cheap. BTW they don’t need another lefty. The logic must be something like the following: the decoy starter is only going to pitch a few times over the first two months. So we don’t need a real pitcher. Just someone that can make a few starts. And Hill I has been effective before if he only has to pitch every couple weeks or so. But still I’m not a fan.

Cowboy26
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  Angelstan

What is a real pitcher?

GrandpaBaseball
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  Cowboy26

Usually plastic or glass, holds iced tea or water Martini’s.

gitchogritchoffmypettis
Legend
Reply to  Angelstan

I’d totally take Rich Hill. Curve ball still works, never needed velo…. sure, if he isn’t 10M or something.

JackFrost
Super Member
1 year ago
Reply to  Jeff Joiner

Good. I don’t want Davidson in any spot, lol.

MarineLayer
Super Member
1 year ago
Reply to  Jeff Joiner

Hill makes no sense given how many lefties are already in the rotation. Maybe someone like Kluber makes more sense. I do like Lugo, however.

Fleckstein
Trusted Member
1 year ago
Reply to  MarineLayer

With the banning of the shift giving advantage to lefty pull hitters, maybe it makes sense to have more lefty pitching.

Cowboy26
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  MarineLayer

Hill makes sense if the other “viable” options are now out of reach https://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2022/12/padres-interested-in-seth-lugo.html

gitchogritchoffmypettis
Legend
Reply to  Cowboy26

Yeah. Let’s not think ourselves into a hole here. He’s got a sub .700 OPS against to right handed hitters and he has a 3/1 k/BB against them. How many right handed #6 starter types do we think we are finding who will give us better than that?

I don’t care if all of our starters are left handed if they all throw 130 innings minimum and have a WHIP under 1.35. I mean, is anyone gonna be like “Sure, you won 90 games…. but your whole rotation was lefty, so lame.”

FungoAle
Legend
1 year ago

I’m ok with Rich Hill. For his age and arm strength, he might be willing to be that 6th pitcher who gets his
start skipped for Ohtani. My comment about 4 lefties is that they all seem to offer a similar repertoire of offerings. Sliders, change up, same speed. I’d like Evo but not at the price.

gitchogritchoffmypettis
Legend
Reply to  FungoAle

Yeah. We’re talking about an ass end add on pitcher. Honestly, one that we kinda hope gets bumped by a guy like Ky Bush in late summer. I’m fine with a pile of lefties that are similar as long as they are all somewhat effective, and Hill’s OK.

FungoAle
Legend
1 year ago

$5M in this environment? He is a veteran and I think the staff would benefit my that. I’m warming up to it.

Cowboy26
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  FungoAle

It looks like Shohei and the 5 Leroys will be playing at a stadium near you this summer. Dont wait. get your tickets now.

Last edited 1 year ago by Cowboy26
JackFrost
Super Member
1 year ago
Reply to  MarineLayer

Soft- tossing lefties don’t age well.

Pass.

Senator_John_Blutarsky
Legend
Reply to  Jeff Joiner

Does anyone really want Davidson on the bump every sixth day?

Cowboy26
Legend
1 year ago

Any sixth starter for the Angels next year will not be on the bump every sixth day. It will probably be closer to the 12 days of Christmas. And if Davidson has to take the pill for us it will be 🎼 Noooo Golden Rings 🎼

FungoAle
Legend
1 year ago

F-no. If Perry even flirts with that idea, Ohtani walks for sure. There would be no better clue to show Shohei there is zero hope for this organization.

gitchogritchoffmypettis
Legend
Reply to  FungoAle

Do you need a warm glass of whiskey milk and your fidget spinner?

FungoAle
Legend
1 year ago

Ah, we got a Tucker fan! Step right up into the dunk tank.

gitchogritchoffmypettis
Legend
Reply to  FungoAle

How does you’re always needing a fainting couch equate to me being a Tucker Davidson fan?

Fansince1971
Legend
1 year ago

These contracts are absolutely wild. Swanson deal has me shaking my head.

Angelstan
Trusted Member
1 year ago

Of note, Swanson got $177 million which is more than a lot of folks predicted. He is a complimentary player. That’s all he is.

Thankfully, it wasn’t with the Angels.

Angelz4ever
Super Member
1 year ago
Reply to  Angelstan

Reluctantly in agreement.

Cowboy26
Legend
1 year ago

So the price for a Premium is now even more premium?

https://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2022/12/pirates-to-sign-austin-hedges.html

steelgolf
Super Member
1 year ago
Reply to  Cowboy26

For that kind of money, Mathis may see if he can get a spring training invite! 🤣

red floyd
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  steelgolf

Why not? His CERA in 2022 was 0.00

Last edited 1 year ago by red floyd
steelgolf
Super Member
1 year ago
Reply to  red floyd

🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣

2GA2Join
Super Member
1 year ago

On one hand I agree that it is good to not dole out more dumb contracts.
On the other hand, we have absolutely no MLB-level starting SS, and this was an off-season featuring 4 prominent FA SSs, and we managed to sign none of them. That doesn’t look good for a team as bad as ours has been for years, and needs serious help.

Fansince1971
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  2GA2Join

Personally never thought the Angels would sign any of the premium shortstops or, frankly, top free agents. So I have no disappointment. This offseason is actually way better than I expected.

Cowboy26
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  Fansince1971

True but We can’t stop here. There’s Still more work to do and remaining options are dwindling.

Fansince1971
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  Cowboy26

The problem is the market prices are so high now that it likely changes the focus to depth pieces only.

FungoAle
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  Twebur

Cubbies will be interesting this year. Thought the Dodgers would have swooped him up.

steelgolf
Super Member
1 year ago
Reply to  FungoAle

Dodgers swooped up JD Martinez, because …………… I have no idea why, except for it is a one year deal.

Cowboy26
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  steelgolf

Because used to be a pretty good hitter and they haven’t signed Ohtani yet so they have the DH position open.

Angelstan
Trusted Member
1 year ago
Reply to  steelgolf

JD is a professional RBI guy that can drive in runs. He will help them. Before the Renfroe trade, I wanted the Angels to consider him. But after Renfroe and Urshela, there wasn’t room and Ohtani takes up the DH spot so it wasn’t a great fit. Maybe next year.

Cowboy26
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  Angelstan

JD’s glove is purely ornamental . He makes J Up look like a gold glover . I’m very happy we have Renfroe and that JD’s not roaming left field for us next year

SchofieldsWalkoff
Trusted Member
1 year ago
Reply to  Twebur

They found a good replacement for Heyward.

Cowboy26
Legend
1 year ago

Retirement would be a good replacement for Heyward.

Fansince1971
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  Jeff Joiner

This is an excellent point Jeff. I agree but the team needs to quickly pivot if not successful and get as much as possible for him.

KingsHalos10
Member
1 year ago
Reply to  Fansince1971

Even though he signed his 1 yr extension, PTP really needs to have a direct heart to heart with Ohtani about his future with the Angels and ask him what it will take for him to fully commit being the 1-2 punch with Trout both financially and overall team needs. If it’s up in the air regardless of this season, he needs to just rip the band aide and fans hearts out and move him for this so called haul everyone is speaking about. If it goes to the Judge situation, he’s gone for nothing. This team will look absolutely foolish if they let him walk on a marketability standing alone and wonder how they were never able to anything positive with two of the best players in MLB. We all know it falls on Moreno for putting marketing and his cronies ahead of actually winning. Hopefully this deal gets done quickly and the new ownership group has a plan already in place and starts putting a good stamp on the team moving forward.

Fansince1971
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  KingsHalos10

Yes. As a fan and from an emotional standpoint- I would love Ohtani to stay. But the logical part of my mind tells me he is already gone.

It would take two things to keep him imo (1) a playoff run in ‘23 and (2) a commitment in the neighborhood of $45m to $50m per year for at least 7 or 8 seasons. I don’t think either is likely to happen. Accordingly even if the new owner is willing to commit another $500 million to Ohtani on top of the $2.5B he/she just paid for the team and all other payroll liabilities, if the team doesn’t make the playoffs Ohtani is gone anyway.

All of this is ti say that if we look at the situation logically and not magically, it’s probably better than 80% that Ohtani is gone. Now if this were Dumb and Dumber that would be a chance. But in the real world, that means you better start working on a plan B which would have to prioritize trading Ohtani and getting something of value for him. .

My personal approach is that I am temporarily no longer emotionally attached to this team. I will wait for (and logically evaluate for myself) the sale and the Ohtani decision before reattaching ti any meaningful extent.

KingsHalos10
Member
1 year ago
Reply to  Fansince1971

100% Everyone has got to put emotions aside and look at it in a business perspective. The Angels aren’t the Yankees in terms of incoming revenue where the Judge deal and crazy payroll can be pushed to the side. If they make that move for a $45m a yr, they will recover that in the marketing of Ohtani. If they can find a taker for. Rendon, even better, but not happening.
Other than Ohtani resigning out of loyalty, I don’t think they have a plan B for him, which they should have been creating since last year.

gitchogritchoffmypettis
Legend
Reply to  KingsHalos10

I think the big mental obstacle for fans is that we all keep talking out our asses about the business end of having billions of dollars.

I have doubts about free spending unicorn NewOwnerz simply because a dog doesn’t suddenly become a bear because someone new owns it. Same stadium, same maximum capacity, same maximum amount of food to sell, same TV deal, etc. Sure, if we win we sell a few more shirts (and split that with all the other teams, as the Phillies are sharing their windfall with us this year), we max out those stadium numbers, we sell a few extra signs etc around the stadium for more money, etc.

Unless it turns out Arte was making MUCH more money than it seems and pocketing it (and none of us have ANY way to know that) then it’s not like the over all pool of money the team can make gets bigger. So unless NewOwnerz the Unicorn is an egomaniac who just wants to win and make less profit like Steve Cohen they will likely maintain a similar but hopefully operationally improved team.

This is why Arte paying Matt Harvey pisses me off. Rendon, sure, star 3B. Teams that try to win will do that. But the money we paid Harvey alone, invested in player development for three years, would have netted us SO MUCH MORE for the SAME OR LESS money.

But the idea that Ohtani will somehow pay for himself? Eh. We’ll know if that’s the case if we sign him and the payroll doesn’t suffer for it. And I mean over the whole length of the contract, not just a couple years where the unicorn goes on a diet to make it work. But again, unless Arte is secretly pissing away billions on players but also being Bob Nutting and pocketing billions, the way payroll has worked here for 15 years I doubt there is a huge pile of wiggle room and I don’t see how NewOwnerz makes that wiggle a lot bigger.

Till they move the team.

Cowboy26
Legend
1 year ago

Unfortunately , Gitch, your animal husbandry analysis may work with life but it doesn’t work in baseball. You talk about new ownership with the same economic conditions not drastically modifying franchise philosophies, but you have a couple of relatively recent examples in the same/similar media markets staring you right in the face.

When the bankrupt parking lot attendant was finally extricated from the Latrine after a record sales price in 2012, the new owners inherited the same exact lipstick on a pig including keeping the attendant as their partner on the parking lots yet doubled the payroll in their first full season controlling the franchise. Their payrolls have traditionally been in the top 3 of all of baseball ever since and have showed only limited concern over the Competitive Balance Tax.

When the Bernie Madoff buddy grifter family finally agreed to sell their controlling interest to Steve Cohen after the 2020 season, Citi field had already been open for 12 seasons. The Mets immediately more than doubled payroll and now after this offseason. they will carry payroll dollars 450% higher than the Wilpons last year of ownership.

This is not the early 2000’s when Major League Baseball was approving anyone even those that were cash poor with lower net worths as long the franchise sales kept rising meteorically. There are a whole array of suitors for this team that have more millions in their couch cushions than anyone of us will ever see but are all fueled by oversize egos that will push them to spend and try to beat up on their old guard established new peers.

Last edited 1 year ago by Cowboy26
gitchogritchoffmypettis
Legend
Reply to  Cowboy26

Yeah, I’ve said it before, I’ll say it again just for you. We are not the Dodgers. We don’t have the ability to make the profits the Dodgers do. “The Dodgers did it” doesn’t mean jack shit compared to us.

Same with a team based in Queens. Especially if, like I said up there, the Mets new owner has openly declared that it’s a pride thing and he’ll spend/waste billions if he has to in order to win. But besides that, we don’t have the ability to make money that the Mets have.

Just ask yourself, who has been the official airline of the LAA Angels? Which major oil company has been with us? Which big shoe company? Carl’s Jr or McDonalds? Who are our major advertisers? Sure, we’ve had a few semi-big fish but yak yogurt etc is pretty C list.

We may get an owner like that, but it’s more likely we will get a partnership owner who intends to, you know, make huge profits.

It’s only a suspicion in my mind, but I think if an ownership group does indeed spend 3B to get the team and then spends like sailors there after they plan to actually move the Los Angeles Angels to Los Angeles and make your whole “dodger’s derd it” thing a reality. It’s what I’d do.

Cowboy26
Legend
1 year ago

Thats true the lowly small market Angels only have the third largest local TV contract in the League. And, yet despite this economic injustice, the lteam will be setting a MLB sale price record within the next 6 months.

gitchogritchoffmypettis
Legend
Reply to  Cowboy26

I may be remembering wrong, and I also may be just totally wrong, but is it possible you’re referring to the BS stats that come with a half dozen caveats and list us as making more money than the Yankees and Giants, just ahead of those revenue juggernauts the White Sox (or was it the Braves… can’t recall)? How much of that TV contract do WE actually own? I know the Mets insane owner didn’t even try to buy out SNY because, as I’ve said, he’s gone full Captain Ahab.

But sure, if you need it that bad, being the Anaheim Angels of Anaheim totally makes as much money for a team as actually being in New York, or Chicago, or Philly…. or Los Angeles. Can’t wait for that unicorn to show up, I’ll enjoy riding it as much as the next guy.

The Angels are far from small market, and they will get a high sales price… until another big city team gets sold. But we also already have a huge payroll. But I know you aren’t stupid, you can’t think that our actual active fanbase is anywhere near the Yankees, Dodgers, Mets, Cubs, Phillies, Red Sox, Giants and the like… even with Japans help.

So my question remains. How will NewOwnerz the Unicorn be making all this new extra money to pay for an even huger payroll? Or are they just planning to make less money because hell, they just spent so much money anyway, and ownership groups are primarily formed to make less money?

gitchogritchoffmypettis
Legend
Reply to  KingsHalos10

It’s not an extension. All he signed was a contract that avoided having to go to arb.

KingsHalos10
Member
1 year ago

Thanks for the correction.

Cowboy26
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  Jeff Joiner

New Reasonable = a team owner who is not going to cut a top notch player development program or cut back in Major League Payroll depth just because we have some mega deals under contract and a payroll that will exceed the CBT.

Lets face it MLB’s competitive balance tax system is officially a joke. Every other major professional sports league (including the English Premier League where they require independent auditing of your books) have much more rigid payroll constraints.

If the new prospective Owners for the Angels aren’t willing to spend at these higher levels , they shouldn’t even bother submitting a bid.

gitchogritchoffmypettis
Legend
Reply to  Cowboy26

I am frustrated by the MLB so much by this. Look at the EPL, the NBA, the NFL. It seems like the more restricted the payroll and the more public (or at least audited) the books are the better the league as a whole is and the more money it makes. I mean, even bad EPL teams make tons of money and draw tons of fans.

But no. It’s still 1954 at 1271 6th Ave NY. NY.

Cowboy26
Legend
1 year ago

And bad EPL teams dont stay in the EPL very long..

gitchogritchoffmypettis
Legend
Reply to  Cowboy26

There’s no way to pull it off in our sport, but relegation’s pretty much the only thing I like about foootbah.

FungoAle
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  Jeff Joiner

Think Giants, Jeff. Correra is only $27AAV, they have room as well to add a big fish in Ohtani.

JackFrost
Super Member
1 year ago
Reply to  Jeff Joiner

Have to disagree here. Keeping Ohtani is more important than any other talent that we might add. There is not any one player out there, or even any three players that are or would be available in the next year and a half that would help us more than keeping Ohtani. This has to be the top priority for the organization (and I think it is). In fact, I believe the intelligent investments the team has made so far this off-season indicate that they DO intend to do everything in their power to keep him. Besides, Perry has said as much. I also would not be surprised if a ridiculous offer for the team has already been made to Arte and this party is behind the scenes providing him with a shopping list. The things they’ve done so far are just so “un Arte-like”. It looks like a baseball mind who really knows what they are doing is calling the shots.

Last edited 1 year ago by JackFrost
Fansince1971
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  JackFrost

But what if Ohtani doesn’t want to stay – which I believe is likely if this team doesn’t make the playoffs next season. Other more successful teams will be opening up their wallets. Are you willing to take the risk of getting nothing for him? Honest question and would like your thought process.

FungoAle
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  Fansince1971

Angels are not putting his name out there for offers. They made the statement loud and clear. My feeling is that by committing to him publicly like that vs dangling his name on the open market displays loyalty and commitment. Angels will try to retain him when his contact runs out, offer the proverbial QO. If he walks, he walks. Angels are not trading him. Perry does not want to go down as GM that trades Ohtani.

Last edited 1 year ago by FungoAle
Fansince1971
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  FungoAle

I truly hope you’re not right. If the Angels lose Ohtani and end up with nothing but a draft pick, it will be one of the biggest mistakes in franchise history and that is saying something.

gitchogritchoffmypettis
Legend
Reply to  JackFrost

Source?

WallyChuckChili
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  JackFrost

Plus what would signing an Ace cost us in FA? Might as well keep the most dynamic baseball player ever as an Angel till he retires.

JackFrost
Super Member
1 year ago

Yeah, exactly.

gitchogritchoffmypettis
Legend

Fun fact. Next off season Ohtani will basically be the same age Rendon was when we signed him.

I’m just saying.

Now please leave your replies full of magical thinking and revisionist history below….

2GA2Join
Super Member
1 year ago

Ohtani is going to pitch as long and well as Nolan, and hit as long and well as Big Papi! Of course!

matthiasstephan
Super Member
1 year ago
Reply to  2GA2Join

Obviously. Looking forward to the MVP battle between Shohei (the Cy Young winner) and Trout (with the best WAR and HR title).

Eric_in_Portland
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  2GA2Join

Surely there’s a better comparison than Big Pill Poppy. Hank Aaron maybe.

Fansince1971
Legend
1 year ago

If Hammerin’ Hank could pitch.

Last edited 1 year ago by Fansince1971
gitchogritchoffmypettis
Legend
Reply to  2GA2Join

Well done my friend. Well done.

GrandpaBaseball
Legend
1 year ago

Say goodnight Rochester or George to Garcie, say goodnight Gracie, goodnight George.

Twebur
Legend
1 year ago

…..goodnight John Boy.

https://youtu.be/cp7_u0kcQRo

red floyd
Legend
1 year ago

[looking for a good clip of Laugh In’s “Say goodnight, Dick”, but can’t find one]

GrandpaBaseball
Legend
1 year ago

Does anyone really believe PTP is done. Because if that is true, we won’t compete very well against our own division, much less against all of MLB next season. This team is injury prone more than any other since 2015 to now. We were the 24th most IL days last season. That was our best since ’15. Heck, they were putting two guys to a gurney just to do Tommy John Surgeries for a while. A couple of our pitchers bought into making some green blender stuff that they were told would fix their messed-up elbows. This team needs real Angels help for our Halos in the form of just avoiding long term injuries. At least Trouty didn’t lead the team in IL days in ’22. Rendon must have set a record for the most ways to being injured and put on the IL. I have pushed for 2 years that one of my favorites is not a SS and yet he still gets penciled in there. Fletcher is a 2nd baseman period. I said he was going to get hurt and he did, look at his ’21 numbers as he played hurt for more than half a season. Walsh last season was hurt all the way through. Stassi must have been hurt because he stunk the joint up bad. The Angels were over-all lucky with starting pitching and the injury bug, but ’23 is a new season. I just hope we don’t see two to a gurney this coming season.

Fansince1971
Legend
1 year ago

Healthy this current team is potentially an 87 game winner.

But with any significant injuries you can start subtracting wins.

Overall, I’m thinking this team, as it is currently built, looks more or less like a .500 ball club.

I doubt any significant move will be made to effect that analysis.

GrandpaBaseball
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  Fansince1971

I do see big improvements for Sandoval, Suarez and Detmers. Shohei has very little room for improvement unless he agrees to a 5 man rotation. After Anderson there is prayer and hope along with cross your fingers. If the pen is not a blow pen, then maybe 87 wins with Trout, Rendon, Fletch, and Walsh and Stassi stating healthy. Does everybody believe Moniak is around by Memorial Day? And is he relief for Trout? I’m seeing 82-80 as a goal. But if healthy then maybe 87, but Texas and Seattle will be better and Asstros are not getting weaker. I have to believe that we missed out on Lorenzen and Vasquez, and we should have Had Swanson signed-sealed and delivered 6 weeks ago.

VladimirTrout27
Trusted Member
1 year ago

I’m hoping Sandoval becomes more consistent and goes deeper into games. Not sure Anderson can repeat last year. Detmers needs to take another leap. I think Saurez is fair, but that may not be enough. Add they need a 6th starter; they need to make a trade. I’m not certain Swanson is a good fit. He strikes out a lot and you’ll probably being paying a ton for his 1 good season (’22) and an above avg season ‘(21). Had Halos locked in another pitcher/closer then I’d be inclined to go for it. Swanson may not be the right piece at this time.

Last edited 1 year ago by VladimirTrout27
GrandpaBaseball
Legend
1 year ago

Eric Hosmer is a toad, KC never looked back and said they missed him. He reminds me of the many players who sign for a gazillion dollars and do very little. Put a fork in him.

GrandpaBaseball
Legend
1 year ago

I think when Ohtani leaves, he is only West Coast bound. Remember when Eppler was after him, it said that he wanted only Left Coast teams. Closer to his native country. Besides the Angels are not going to ever be winners without rebuilding from bottom up. I appreciate what PTP has tried to do, but it’s all built on thin ice, Arte will not ever change the way he does business. I am convinced today as I was a few years back that winning was second to putting money in his pocket.

Cowboy26
Legend
1 year ago

So Arte’s evil influence will extend well beyond the end of his ownership tenure in May?

Wow hes diabolical.

GrandpaBaseball
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  Cowboy26

I don’t know about diabolical, but I do know that the cable money was not used when needed. He could have made the team winners if he wanted. He was not motivated winning, only box office and he has lost that and now he wants to sell.

He is hanging on as long as he can to Shohei because of the financial gain, not for W-L records.

red floyd
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  Cowboy26

comment image

Eric_in_Portland
Legend
1 year ago

My prediction: if the Angels are in 1st place and if we have a new owner, and this is July I’m talking about, Shohei will sign a huge extension with us.

If Arte still owns the team then Shohei will be traded. If he isn’t traded and we don’t do better than 3rd then he’s gone after the season

Fansince1971
Legend
1 year ago

The last thing you said is the thing the team cannot allow to happen. They cannot get nothing for Ohtani.

GrandpaBaseball
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  Fansince1971

Shohei will be in contention for one of the two awards, that being MVP or CY, and he will be putting fannies in the seats, and Arte finalizes the sale in Aug. or Sept. and he is richer for it.

What is crazy that is being thrown around for a team that does not even know where they will play in a few years. Are they going to stay in Anaheim or play on wet foggy nights in Long Beach or build their own between the 10 and 60 at the 57 or on a toxic dump in Carson. Is Irvine still an option. How do you negotiate all the lawsuits or are they Arte’s problem.

KingsHalos10
Member
1 year ago

And out of all those possible locations, it just proves how great and accessible the current location is.

I think we all talked about it a few weeks ago. I mentioned a Halos heaven series from like 7 or 8 years ago that discussed all the potential socal locations. All had issues with accessibility.

Last edited 1 year ago by KingsHalos10
gitchogritchoffmypettis
Legend
Reply to  Fansince1971

Sure you can, cause you just don’t trade Bade Root.

Then what you do is you act like all your owner has to do is throw the most possible money at the problem. Then when Bade Root goes somewhere else you get pissed and act like if your owner had just thrown even more money at him he’d have had no choice but to sign here.

Because baseball players are like automatons. They MUST go to the highest bidder. Nothing else factors into the decision.

Then, when Bade Root decides to go with another option we decided was not an option we can cope and seethe and get nothing for him because you don’t trade Bade Root and you don’t let him sign anywhere else even though you can’t actually stop him.

It’s the only smart choice.

Fansince1971
Legend
1 year ago

Right?! Because EVERYONE wants to play in Anaheim- unless they don’t. Oh and also a team with two enormous contracts can automatically add a third and even bigger one because- well just because. That is magical thinking and Anaheim is the home of Disneyland after all.

Last edited 1 year ago by Fansince1971
gitchogritchoffmypettis
Legend
Reply to  Fansince1971

Well, what you are forgetting is dad’s a total asshole.

Wait, I mean Arte. Arte is a total asshole. See, there isn’t a soul alive who wouldn’t love to sign here but Arte is so cheap, so evil, that he manages to make The Heim feel like Murmansk.

2002heaven
Super Member
1 year ago

comment image?v=1618407919
Good riddance to him……And he can go count his money in the Grand Canyon for all I care, BYE AGAIN!!!!!…...
💪 💪 💪

Last edited 1 year ago by 2002heaven
JackFrost
Super Member
1 year ago
Reply to  Fansince1971

Why not ? If we are winning and doing well with him on the roster I think that even without a new contract in hand he will NOT be traded. In fact, for some reason you seem to continually ignore the fact that Perry has repeatedly said they are not trading Ohtani.

Get used to it. He’s not gonna be traded.

Last edited 1 year ago by JackFrost
GrandpaBaseball
Legend
1 year ago

You and ’71 are making sense no doubt. I say if Arte owns the team on July 31st that even with a losing record, Shohei will be here. Arte does still believe he knows what he is doing, and that is to take every last dime possible with him.

Fansince1971
Legend
1 year ago

Well if Arte still owns the team in even June 2023, then this extremely important decision will be made by the same clowns who have made previous questionable decisions and I for one would NOT be optimistic. Hopefully Arte will be counting all his cash by that time and the decision will be some other billionaire’s to make.

2002heaven
Super Member
1 year ago

 😆  😆 

JackFrost
Super Member
1 year ago

I think if the sale is close but not complete by the All-Star break and the Angels are either in 1st or very close (say 2nd place and only two or three games back of the Astros), and lined up for a Wild Card, and playing well I agree with you…

The things we’ve done so far this off-season are consistent with a team that intends to keep Ohtani. In short, we are not planning for 10 years down the road, we are planning for the next 3-4 years. This is in fact what we SHOULD be doing. So far I am pleased with the off-season…Let’s see what if anything else happens.

Last edited 1 year ago by JackFrost
gitchogritchoffmypettis
Legend
Reply to  JackFrost

I don’t think it’s smart, but it is totally possible that NewOwnerz are coming into this intending to pay out the nose for Ohtani AND try to keep a full roster stocked for the next ten years because there can’t possibly be a better PR move for the new guys than Bade Root. It is, after all, a LONG term investment for them. Maybe bleeding cash for 7 years is cool with them if it establishes a 30 year period where we somehow make as much money as the Dodgers.

But holy shit there are about 100 way that can go horribly wrong and we become swamped and there are about 5 ways they manage to thread the needle, do what we all wish for, and make money. When you factor in new stadium issues, eventually a new TV contract, etc…. our chances of getting everything we want exist, but it’s rough.

You know who is basically a 30 year old FA pitcher? Ohtani.

You know which owner was always trying to thread the needle? Arte.

2002heaven
Super Member
1 year ago

Yeah, like leaving!!
“Bernie” signed him on a 1yr so that this would guarantee him to be around while he still owns the team and milk it like a stone. Then he goes across the street, across the country, or to Harris Co TX to the best organization in MLB and just keeps on winning. So glad you figured that out before STUPID PAINT CHIP EATING ME!!!! MY PATTON STATE HOSPITAL CELL WALLS ARE SMEARED WITH MY FECES……
BYE!!!!

FungoAle
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  JackFrost

What exactly have the Angels done to lure Ohtani to stay?

JackFrost
Super Member
1 year ago
Reply to  FungoAle

Well, the past is the past. That is over with and we can’t change it.

That said, so far this off-season I think they have been doing pretty well. If I were Shohei I would definitely get the feeling that they are serious about winning in 2023. Now, obviously whether or not all of these moves translate into wins on the field is a different question…

We shall see.

2002heaven
Super Member
1 year ago
Reply to  JackFrost

 😂  😂  😆 

JackFrost
Super Member
1 year ago
Reply to  2002heaven

Go scurry on home to “Lookout Landing.”

Fool.

JackFrost
Super Member
1 year ago

I would not be so convinced he is leaving if I were you ….

GrandpaBaseball
Legend
1 year ago

Good article from Jaffe that Jeff posted. It’s an explanation of just exactly what is happening with long term monies being handed out. But with that being explained I still see no reason to pay for long term (10+ yrs.) with players in their mid to late 30’s.

Angelz4ever
Super Member
1 year ago

Eric Hosmer getting DFA’d, MLB minimum wage risk. Maybe we can claim him…..?

Cowboy26
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  Angelz4ever

Hoss would work if Walsh is healthy enough to play outfield . Perry talked about that possibility earlier in the offseason when we acquired Gio

KingsHalos10
Member
1 year ago
Reply to  Cowboy26

Why not give it a shot. If he doesn’t work out, just DFA him again. If it works out Perry looks like a genius. Better than 11mil for Gallo.
Anyone interested in a reunion with Calhoun?

Cowboy26
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  KingsHalos10

Unfortunately, like Jim & John,Kole is too old for the game now.

I believe the only pitching he can still hit off of is Angel pitching so that really wouldn’t help us.

Fansince1971
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  Angelz4ever

Isn’t Hosmer under contract for around $15m in 2023. If the Angels claim him, how would they not be responsible for paying him what is owed under that contract?

Last edited 1 year ago by Fansince1971
Cowboy26
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  Fansince1971

he would have to pass through waivers and then sign here as a free agent. where he would only make the league minimum since baseball does not allow players to get paid twice in the same season (I’m surprised the MLBPA allows this obvious infringement in basic human rights) and theres no motivation to make more than that. Of course he could sign with any team at that point.

Fansince1971
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  Cowboy26

If he could be signed to the major league minimum then it’s not a bad idea at all.

But he would have to pass through waivers. If the Angels claimed him off waivers they would have to pay the salary or negotiate a deal with the RedSox.

Last edited 1 year ago by Fansince1971
Eric_in_Portland
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  Fansince1971

Didn’t we have to pay albert’s salary when he went to you know where? And you know who had to pay the league minimum? That’s how I recall it but I could be wrong

Angelz4ever
Super Member
1 year ago

That’s because he signed a contract with us. We’d only pay league minimum and could release Hosmer at any point damageless

Fansince1971
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  Angelz4ever

I’m not sure this is correct. He’d have to pass completely through waivers and then agree to a deal with the Angels for the ML minimum. But he could do the same with any other team.

If the Angels claim him before he passes through waivers, they could owe him approximately $15 million. Or he could be pulled back an an agreement entered into.

So many possibilities. It’s unlikely he would be claimed off waivers due to the risk of being stuck with that contract.

Fansince1971
Legend
1 year ago

I think if he clears waivers he can sign a minimum deal with whomever.

But if the player is claimed off waivers, the claiming team takes over the contract or negotiates a deal with the team who has the player under contract.

Here’s what MLB.com adds:

“Once a player is claimed, his team faces three options. It can pull the player back and keep him, negotiate a trade with the claiming team or let the player go. In the last scenario, the claiming team takes full responsibility for the player’s remaining salary. If the two sides decide to work out a trade, they have two days to do so.”

Cowboy26
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  Fansince1971

I suspect in the case of Hosmer, the Chowds already sought a trade for him where they would eat some of his salary but found no takers so they decided to DFA him.

Marcotor
Trusted Member
1 year ago
Reply to  Cowboy26

Add in San Diego is on the hook for 12.25MM of that salary just to make it complicated 🙂

Cowboy26
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  Marcotor

I guess that made it that much easier for the Carmines to DFA him.

AnAngelsFan
Super Member
1 year ago
Reply to  Cowboy26

It’s not an infringement of a basic human right, its basic contract theory. If Hosmer is released, that’s a breach of contract and his damages are the $15 million salary. However, if he is able to get another job that he couldn’t have had while under contract, that reduces his damages by the amount of his new salary.

The same rule applies to leases. If you break a 1-year lease 6 months early, you still have to pay the monthly rent for the rest of the lease. However, is the apartment complex is full and is able to find a new tenant in 2-3 months, then you are no longer required to pay rent after the new tenant takes over because the apartment isn’t losing any more money as the result of your breach.

Cowboy26
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  AnAngelsFan

I apologize if the opening into Sars land wasn’t well lit. Hopefully you only had a short stay in the Chasm.

AnAngelsFan
Super Member
1 year ago
Reply to  Cowboy26

Okay, yep. Usually, I’m just returning the sarcasm or being obstinate for the fun of it, but that time I actually fell in. Sorry.

steelgolf
Super Member
1 year ago
Reply to  Fansince1971

Hosmer just got DFA’d by a team that was only paying him league minimum. The rest of his salary is being paid by The Padres. He does not need to clear waivers, as far as I know.

gitchogritchoffmypettis
Legend
Reply to  Angelz4ever

It’s not a horrible idea for a platoonish guy

FungoAle
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  Angelz4ever

Only interested if you could sign him and trade Walsh for Ha-Seong Kim. Hosmer is a bit of a tool.

Cowboy26
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  FungoAle

The Padres would trade us Kim for Walshie?

You must adding a little extra somethin somethin to you cerveza Fungo.

FungoAle
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  Cowboy26

Toss in whatever, Padres are in need of a 1st baseman so they can move Jake back to 2nd. I really don’t want Hosmer though.

Cowboy26
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  FungoAle

We have 4 bench spots to fill this year. If Fletch is our SS & Rengifo our second baseman, right now those spots are going to O’Hoppe, Gio, Thaiss & Moniak.

Gio isn’t going anywhere and Thaiss has no options left while Moniak & O’hoppe can be optioned.

The Angels have up to $20.5 million left to be ( assuming Perry can spend up to the cap) to improve that benches well as our part time 6th starter ( We can do better than Tucker Davidson who also has no options) and possibly one more bullpen addition to the 8 where we currently have 2 open spots (Herget is a lock and Loup,Estevez,Tepera, Quijada & Barria aren’t getting released) and a wide array of minor leaguers on our 40 man ( and some that have not been added yet) to chose from .

So that leaves up to 4 spots ( 5 if at least someone gets hatcheted) left to fill for $20 million big ones.

Not sure that is possible in this market to find true upgrades at all of those spots for that amount

Mia
Legend
Mia
1 year ago
Reply to  Angelz4ever

Fletch says Walsh is expected to be 100% healthy by spring. Not sure we need Hosmer along with Gio.

Fansince1971
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  Mia

100% in April. 50% by July. TrAdition

Mia
Legend
Mia
1 year ago
Reply to  Fansince1971

Fair enough

Cowboy26
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  Fansince1971

100% from September 2020 thru May 2022.

And hes still only 29 years old so odds are good he’ll be 100% for a sustained period of time again.

max
Trusted Member
max
1 year ago
Reply to  Angelz4ever

Are you sure we wouldn’t be on the hook for the original contract?

max
Trusted Member
max
1 year ago
Reply to  max

nm, read below