LA Angels Wednesday News Crash: Eliminated

Good morning Angels fans. If it is a morning to be good. The Angels are not, they are bad. Have some links.

Angels News

Another day, another Angels loss to Houston. At least Ohtani hit his 45th home run.

The Angels have been eliminated from the playoffs. Took them long enough.

Justin Upton is officially out for the season. Wait he wasn’t already?

With the Angels eliminated, Ohtani’s MVP is the only good ting left to look forward to. At least Sports Illustrated agrees it should be obviously his.

Raisel Iglesias is still great though, so there’s that.

Around Baseball

Yankee fans are panicking as their playoff chances diminish. It is delightful.

HAHA

The one who really fell though has been the Padres, now at a very low 3% chance for October.

Wow, that is horrible

It isn’t just the fans though, GM Preller fired their farm director.

Rangers outright Kohei Arihara. They cut him after he signed a 2 year deal in the offseason. Angels could use him…

MLB and the players union open a hearing Monday about the shortened 2020 season.

The Blue Jays and Rays got a little heated over a scouting report card being dropped on the field

Anything I missed? Post below for upvotes.

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H.T. Ennis
Admin
Super Member
1 month ago

the blue jays are really gonna make me root for the yankees, huh? amazing. just wow.

Eric_in_Portland
Super Member
1 month ago
Reply to  H.T. Ennis

It might be petty but I’m rooting against Toronto because if they miss the playoffs it knocks down Vladdy’s MVP vote a little.

DowningDude
Super Member
1 month ago

Petty indeed. But I like the cut of your jib.

H.T. Ennis
Admin
Super Member
1 month ago

You know what, that’s fair! Two points in NYY’s favor!

FungoAle
Super Member
1 month ago

Max Scherzer with an 0.61 WHIP this year. Incredible. This is why you don’t fall in love with prospects. When you can get a game changer like Max, you do it. Max will resign with the Dongers and pitch 3 to 4 more years.

H.T. Ennis
Admin
Super Member
1 month ago
Reply to  FungoAle

.81

FungoAle
Super Member
1 month ago
Reply to  H.T. Ennis

Still incredible, Brewers have two aces that are under 1.00. They are 7.5-1 to win the WS. Not long enough odds for my liking.

JackFrost
Super Member
1 month ago
Reply to  FungoAle

Not enough offense.

FungoAle
Super Member
1 month ago
Reply to  JackFrost

That is exactly what they said about the 2010, 2012 and 2014 SF Giants. They had stout starting pitching and competent bullpen.

Last edited 1 month ago by FungoAle
h27kim
Trusted Member
1 month ago

Iglesias is also still a to-be FA, which makes me a bit unhappy (I’m of either extend him or shoulda dealt him for prospects tribe.)

steelgolf
Super Member
1 month ago
Reply to  h27kim

Extend him.

FungoAle
Super Member
1 month ago
Reply to  steelgolf

Spotrac projects Rasiel’s AAV at $15.5M, do we think Arte will want to get mixed up in that? Maybe 2-yrs but I like the QO approach personally.

FungoAle
Super Member
1 month ago
Reply to  h27kim

Do we think he would want to resign with this ballclub? If we don’t think he will or is deemed too expensive, give him a qualifying offer at 1-year $18.9M and get the compensatory draft pick.

I would have traded him to the Phillies, man their pen is costing them

Cowboy26
Super Member
1 month ago
Reply to  FungoAle

Hosey says Si

FungoAle
Super Member
1 month ago
Reply to  Cowboy26

He is certainly worthy in receiving an extension. 3-yrs is a little too steep for me. Give him an higher AAV with a shorter leash

Cowboy26
Super Member
1 month ago
Reply to  h27kim

The Tribe is no more. They’re the Guardians now.

Jeff Joiner
Editor
Super Member
1 month ago

I think there’s a decent shot Upton is done as an Angel. The starting outfield next year will be Adell/Trout/Marsh barring a trade. The bulk of the DH at bats will go to Ohtani.

At best, maybe Justin sticks around to DH 1-2 days a week to rest Ohtani and maybe gets onto the grass 1-2 days a week to spell one of the starters.

But even then, he’s below average with both the bat and glove.

DaveChalk
Member
1 month ago
Reply to  Jeff Joiner

I would love Upton to be gone as an Angel. I just don’t see any upside to keeping him part time considering how streaky he is. I know its not my money but with guys like Pujols and Upton the salary is a sunk cost anyways so shouldn’t you be making more a baseball decision on who can actually contribute more – them in a part time role or a cheap replacement player

gitchogritchoffmypettis
Super Member
Reply to  DaveChalk

I think it’ll be a spring training thing. The IFs include if Adell/Marsh come in crushing it Upton is very expendable. IF those guys crush it but Upton is also crushing it they will find a way to use all 3 and rest Ohtani a little because, sure you have to pay Upton either way, but if you get a part time OF/DH (maybe 1B?) who manages a .700 OPS then fine, keep him. If either of the kids falter you still have Upton.

But if Upton just looks like total crap and a guy like Delino Deshields Jr would have more value as a AAAA guy then Upton may just get dumped because the 25/40 man spot is more valuable.

So Upton better be training to beat Drago this winter.

Jeff Joiner
Editor
Super Member
1 month ago

Agreed. He’s definitely getting an invite to Tempe. It’s not like it is a sure thing that both Adell and Marsh will be here next March. It’s not a foregone conclusion that Upton can’t be productive part time.

H.T. Ennis
Admin
Super Member
1 month ago
Reply to  DaveChalk

I think this year has really shown how hard it is to find a cheap replacement level baseball player.

Hard for me to see any upside to cutting him.

DaveChalk
Member
1 month ago
Reply to  H.T. Ennis

Do you think it should be though? Lol, I know our bench OF’s have been a murderer’s row of obscure but I just can’t help thinking OF should have by far the largest supply of average offensive players you don’t have to pay a lot for but maybe its adding a nuance that it takes a certain person to be a good part time player. But maybe I’m dead wrong and its not as easy as I think to find decent outfielders from the 30+ age pile.

Eric_in_Portland
Super Member
1 month ago
Reply to  DaveChalk

they don’t call it “Navapile” for nothing.

gitchogritchoffmypettis
Super Member
Reply to  DaveChalk

I feel the same way, but it appears I’m wrong. Off the top of my head I can name the Cardinals, Reds, Pirates and Dodgers as teams I saw were having trouble finding useful OF help this year… I bet the Indians and Rangers did too and I just didn’t see it.

So I guess it actually is harder than I think. It’s one of the reasons I am not totally on board the “F Taylor Ward” train. I bet he gets snapped up and used by someone right away if we cut him.

matthiasstephan
Trusted Member
1 month ago

Is Ward on the block? We can’t keep stashing him in AAA until 10 players get hurt?

Cowboy26
Super Member
1 month ago

No . Hes been hurt down at AAA. He was activated earlier this week. I believe he has one more option remaining next year so unless we want to jettison him off the 40 man. he’ll probably be back next year for the Angels.

gitchogritchoffmypettis
Super Member

The Giants were looking for OF at the trade deadline and suffering with Tauchman/Slater out there. I’d also love to invite you to head over to an Indians board and let em know how awesome it is having Josh Naylor, Eddie Rosario and Bradley Zimmer on the grass.
 🇧🇷  🇩🇯  🇸🇽  🦄 

H.T. Ennis
Admin
Super Member
1 month ago
Reply to  DaveChalk

Haha, perhaps not in reality, but in practice, we have to look at what the Angels have done over the past few years! =)

You make a good point though, and you’re prob right. In a theoretical world, we wouldn’t need Upton because we could find someone better. And technically I think we’re discussing the theoretical in this hypothetical rather than the real world.

DaveChalk
Member
1 month ago
Reply to  H.T. Ennis

Did we just have a Princess Bride poison scene moment?

H.T. Ennis
Admin
Super Member
1 month ago
Reply to  DaveChalk

lmao

H.T. Ennis
Admin
Super Member
1 month ago
Reply to  H.T. Ennis

we don’t have the money to drop $10M on a corner OF when Upton is making 25

max
Trusted Member
max
1 month ago
Reply to  DaveChalk

I agree. Cheap Arte’ is not afraid to pay players to play for other teams. Hamilton, Pujols, Gary PED, Wells, et al

Mia
Super Member
Mia
1 month ago
Reply to  Jeff Joiner

Yup. If they’re willing to dump Pujols, no reason they wouldn’t be willing to dump Upton, too.

Jeff Joiner
Editor
Super Member
1 month ago
Reply to  Mia

Wells, GMJ, Pujols….

Arte has paid a ton to guys who no longer played for him.

Mia
Super Member
Mia
1 month ago
Reply to  Jeff Joiner

I was thinking of it as a Perry decision since he did what Eppler didn’t have the stones for, but now I feel stupid for not realizing of course it’s Arte.

We can add Hambone to that list.

Cowboy26
Super Member
1 month ago
Reply to  Jeff Joiner

Uh, You forgot about the hambone

FungoAle
Super Member
1 month ago
Reply to  Jeff Joiner

I called this a while ago, he’ll be let go. Regardless of Marsh’s and Adell’s performance. Offers very little and takes up a roster spot.

Twebur
Super Member
1 month ago

Fernando Guanare 6-1 140 pounds, get this guy some food and we might have a prospect
https://www.milb.com/player/fernando-guanare-699121

https://twitter.com/TaylorBlakeWard/status/1440373441069150209?s=20

Jeff Joiner
Editor
Super Member
1 month ago
Reply to  Twebur

very nice.

rosstrade
Member
1 month ago
Reply to  Twebur

That is awesome.

matthiasstephan
Trusted Member
1 month ago
Reply to  Twebur

This is why we don’t sign a top-tier FA SS this year. We only want a stop gap until Paris or Jeremiah Jackson reach the majors.

FungoAle
Super Member
1 month ago

Gotta leave room for the $400M man – SHOWTIME

matthiasstephan
Trusted Member
1 month ago
Reply to  FungoAle

And two starters, and some bullpen pieces, and maybe a back up catcher. But yes, Ohtani needs a raise (but I am hoping it is scaled to really hit in 2023, when Upton is also off the books).

FungoAle
Super Member
1 month ago

I honestly don’t see how the Angels can afford 3 bloated contracts. It’s not the way to construct a team. But I think this is why we won’t sign a FA top tier SS this off-season.

matthiasstephan
Trusted Member
1 month ago
Reply to  FungoAle

Haven’t we always had a few (at least three) big contracts? Don’t most teams?

smithy610
Member
1 month ago

This is probably one of those times where I’m thankful Maddon is the manager instead, of, say Scioscia.

As the MVP race is tightening up, the dreaded Triple Crown is up for discussion again, and the Angels officially eliminated, Maddon has been consistent and stood by his man since Day 1. I can imagine that if Scioscia was still managing this team, he would advocate for Vlad Jr., stating TC and playoff race, much like the way he publicly undermined Trout’s MVP campaign against Cabrera V.1.

gitchogritchoffmypettis
Super Member
Reply to  smithy610

Source? I’d like to see this advocating against Trout you speak of. If you’re talking about Soth saying “Triple Crown, that’s pretty impressive…..” well, I said that too. So would most people. It doesn’t mean Trout shouldn’t have won.

smithy610
Member
1 month ago

Sorry, I misremembered. It wasn’t the Triple Crown thing against Cabrera. It was the 2016 season in which the Angels as usual was out of playoff contention early. Scioscia said the MVP should come from a “contending” team:

https://www.ocregister.com/2016/08/28/angels-mike-scioscia-says-mvp-should-come-from-a-contender/

https://beta.thescore.com/mlb/news/1080998-scioscia-mvp-award-depends-on-team-success/amp

smithy610
Member
1 month ago
Reply to  smithy610

I vaguely remember some chatter among the voters which was like, “Well…if his own manager doesn’t even think he should be MVP, then why would we vote for Trout?!”

gitchogritchoffmypettis
Super Member
Reply to  smithy610

I know I tend to respect a man a lot more if he holds an opinion for years and years and then, when it applies to his own guy, he makes an about face and changes his mind. It shows the strength of character and leadership I think we’re all looking for in all areas of life.

I don’t necessarily agree with 2016 Soth, if a guy is many WAR ahead of the runner up then he’d be a legit MVP. But I also get the “How valuable is that WAR if the team losses most of it’s games?” sentiment. The voters should be weighing that.

rosstrade
Member
1 month ago

Once again, Gitch, you are proven wrong.

Where is the “GENIUS” that you profess you are

It is clearly in a realm outside of baseball.

DowningDude
Super Member
1 month ago
Reply to  rosstrade

I think he just asked to see the source. Nice try

gitchogritchoffmypettis
Super Member
Reply to  rosstrade

Yep. How could I have forgotten this? That’s totally Soth saying Cabrera should be MVP for winning the Triple Crown. I’ve been totally moated.

What Soth said in 2016 is, arguably, right. I mean, not if you’re talking about two players with a huge difference in stats, but I’d understand giving it to an 7 WAR player over a 10 WAR player on a loser team maybe.

FungoAle
Super Member
1 month ago
Reply to  smithy610

The shine is of Maddon. Two years managing and two 4th place finishes. This guy is way overrated as a tactician. I don’t want to hear the injury excuse. All clubs have them.

smithy610
Member
1 month ago
Reply to  FungoAle

I’m not excusing Maddon, but I’m not blaming it on him either. This team already had problems winning WITH Mike Trout. And now Trout didn’t even play for most of this season. Maddon is being truthful when he said he didn’t have his core for the rest of the season. I truly believe having Trout and Rendon – heck, maybe even Upton – for longer than they actually did this season, that the Angels would be at least be legitimately fighting for a WC spot. There’s just no way to be a legitimate playoff contender when you have Gosselin, Mayfield, Lagares, Ward, etc. hitting in the 3 or 4 spots.

Maddon drives me crazy with his bullpen management. But I like that he has unleashed Ohtani, was able to get Upton going by being creative, even if only for a short period of time, has played Jared every day, hasn’t yoyo’ed Marsh and Adell between playing and the bench, and when he saw that there was zero chance the Angels would make it, even if not technically mathematically eliminated, he has started auditioning the young pitchers and he’s now playing for next season.

gitchogritchoffmypettis
Super Member
Reply to  smithy610

Seems like a solid measure of his season… a C Grade. Average but not good because of lots of reasons.

smithy610
Member
1 month ago

I would really like to see Maddon manage a full season in which he has the benefit of his core for most of the season. I know that there will always be injuries, and I’m not expecting Trout/Rendon/Ohtani/Walsh to be healthy and playing all 162 games. But if they get to play together for at least 80-90% of the season – then we will be able to see and fairly judge Maddon’s managerial skills, IMO.

bradllee424
Trusted Member
1 month ago
Reply to  smithy610

I agree. You really can’t fault Maddon for this season. He has really had nothing to work with when all the top players went down early in the season. You can’t judge him until this team is mostly healthy for a season.

Twebur
Super Member
rosstrade
Member
1 month ago

Stefanic hit a 2-run home run on Tuesday, he’s hitting .397 this month with a .470 OBP.

The Angels claim the reason they aren’t calling him up to the Big Show is that they want to give him time to develop while playing everyday.

With Rengifo and Wong underperforming, this doesn’t make sense to me. Watching these guys play is brutal, esp Rengifo.

I appreciate Captain Jack and his 10 dingers, but he’s only batting .200 and his defense has been spotty.

Stefanic is a classic Eckstein type player proving others wrong since his high school days.

He’s 25 years old, not some young kid.

The main reason to watch Angels baseball now is to see the young players develop and hope Shohei finishes the season strong to get an MVP or home run title or 10 wins.

I can’t stand Angels ownership and management. They make it hard to be a fan

H.T. Ennis
Admin
Super Member
1 month ago
Reply to  rosstrade

Maybe the view the pitching development more important than Stefanic’s, and perhaps they feel that having Stefanic in the field would actively harm pitcher development.

Twebur
Super Member
1 month ago
Reply to  H.T. Ennis

Or, maybe they have legitimate 40 man roster issues..find it hard to believe his defense is much worse than Rengifo, Ward, Wong, Rojas without showing obvious signs he’s a defensive butcher at AAA. 650 innings this year and only 9 errors….defense is a lot more complicated, but his bat might make up for it. We will need to improve the offense next year, not just the pitching.

Jeff Joiner
Editor
Super Member
1 month ago
Reply to  Twebur

Would losing Wong really hurt? Or even Rengifo? Then again, I highly doubt either gets claimed.

I understand the frustration. We have several pieces we know aren’t part of the future but we’re not getting a look at a guy who could be.

FungoAle
Super Member
1 month ago
Reply to  Twebur

Agree, we need one more competent OF. I’d target Bryan Reynolds on the cheap bastard Pirates. Reynolds is what we hope Marsh will become. Why not just make the swap and get on with chasing the ring.

smithy610
Member
1 month ago
Reply to  H.T. Ennis

Maybe the view the pitching development more important than Stefanic’s,

This could be one of the reasons. The team knows it has big, glaring holes in pitching. It should be Perry’s #1 priority this offseason. And before spending the big bucks on a pitcher, they would like to know if they have someone in the pipeline who could be good enough, and so they don’t blow their load on just one player.

gitchogritchoffmypettis
Super Member
Reply to  smithy610

I think they have already “seen” Stefanic and have decided what they’ll do with him in 2022. Personally I hope it’s to bring him to MLB camp this March. But if they don’t need a look at him at the MLB level right now why add him to the roster?

Eric_in_Portland
Super Member
1 month ago
Reply to  H.T. Ennis

as mentioned, he has fewer errors than Rengifo. From what I can tell his range is not as great.

Eric_in_Portland
Super Member
1 month ago
Reply to  H.T. Ennis

The only thing we have to go on is Perry’s comment suggesting there’s something (he didn’t specify) holding Stefanic back. Since Stefanic is hitting .340 we assume its his fielding.

Yet Perry has brought up a succession of AAA pitchers with 5+ ERAs. Wouldn’t we agree that *they* need to work on something? Ok, they can work on it in Anaheim. But not Stefanic?

Perhaps Perry wants to showcase Rengifo. If Stefanic came up and did well it would lower Rengifo’s value…if he still has any.

But that’s as much a guess as the “defense” thing.

gitchogritchoffmypettis
Super Member

I think the pitching cannon fodder we are watching is largely guys who are going to lose roster spots soon…. or not get one and be exposed. They don’t need to do that with The Plummer….. I hope. He may even be the cheaper AAAA replacement for Gosselin so they can spend a little more on a back up catcher, for example.

H.T. Ennis
Admin
Super Member
1 month ago

From what I’ve seen, his fielding is atrocious.

Also important to note that Stefanic is not only behind Rengifo in the Angels org chart, but probably Barreto as well

toad2065
Member
1 month ago
Reply to  H.T. Ennis

Impossible! Barreto is a total loss. Eppler’s parting FU gift.

gitchogritchoffmypettis
Super Member
Reply to  rosstrade

And I still hope they don’t bring him up just to piss you off.

Jeff Joiner
Editor
Super Member
1 month ago

chill on making things personal.

DowningDude
Super Member
1 month ago

Would like to see Mike and the Stefanics in my Living Years.

Twebur
Super Member
1 month ago
Reply to  DowningDude

Say it loud, say it clear……All We need is a miracle, all we need is you (Mike Stefanic)

FungoAle
Super Member
1 month ago
Reply to  rosstrade

Next winter, let’s pick up FA middle infielders on the cheap, they are commonly available. Rengifo, Stefanic, Barreto and Wong are really nothing more that waiver wire material to be honest, right? I don’t trust AAA numbers at all.

MarineLayer
Trusted Member
1 month ago

Seems as if the Angels are the only team with injuries and fatigue. This is the surefire explanation why they are so bloody awful. Clearly, it has nothing to do with their dreadful leadership and decision making.

gitchogritchoffmypettis
Super Member
Reply to  MarineLayer

I think it’s all a karma circle. The Angels have a lot of assholes for fans. So it creates the team those fans deserve. We need more crystals, veganism and yoga.

Twebur
Super Member
1 month ago

To battle these negative karmic forces……… goat yoga is needed.

rosstrade
Member
1 month ago

“The Angels have a lot of assholes for fans.”

Hey, that reminds me of you, Gitch….

Senator_John_Blutarsky
Super Member
Reply to  rosstrade

To quote the “whine and cheese” crowd:

“Thank you for avoiding personal attacks. Very kind of you.”

matthiasstephan
Trusted Member
1 month ago

Which you respond to by using a personal attack? Much appreciated, truly. I am glad we can keep this a civil space to discuss baseball among fans.

Jeff Joiner
Editor
Super Member
1 month ago
Reply to  rosstrade

Let’s cool it. Both of you.

gitchogritchoffmypettis
Super Member
Reply to  rosstrade

I’m a total asshole. I won’t deny it.

I’m pretty convinced the Rays always win because their fanbase is gritty Cuban immigrants and nice grandmas. I’m just waiting for the science to catch up to my idea and prove it.

DowningDude
Super Member
1 month ago

Dang gitcho. RE LAX. Although in looking in the mirror I’m not sure I can argue.

Eric_in_Portland
Super Member
1 month ago
Reply to  DowningDude

2002heaven posts irrelevant photos. Gitch posts mockery. It’s schtick. Sometimes it’s entertaining.

Marcotor
Member
1 month ago
Reply to  MarineLayer

Don’t forget umpires! Every Umpire in baseball is part of a conspiracy to Only Screw the Angels, and cause them to lose games. Just read the gamethreads, you’ll see.

DowningDude
Super Member
1 month ago
Reply to  Marcotor

a day isn’t complete unless i see you make this comment! YES!

FungoAle
Super Member
1 month ago
Reply to  Marcotor

There has been a shit-pot full of “kill the umpire” comments this season. I think it has been a result of a subminimal cover-up knowing the Angels were a poorly built team this year.

DowningDude
Super Member
1 month ago
Reply to  FungoAle

Marcotor been beating that drum since, well … maybe this play:
http://mediadownloads.mlb.com/mlbam/2009/10/20/mlbtv_nyaana_7078739_1m.mp4

wihalofan made an entire comic strip about it … there were several “we’re f’d by MLB shortly thereafter.” I believe there was some conspiracy in short bursts, but not the crazy EVERY PLAY GOES AGAINST US nonsense that Marcotor thinks we all do here. Anyway, he gets to post this every day and I look forward to it, I guess. 😀 Yay!

DowningDude
Super Member
1 month ago
Reply to  DowningDude

copy/paste as it doesn’t embed here very well.

Last edited 1 month ago by DowningDude
Marcotor
Member
1 month ago
Reply to  DowningDude

Read the threads. Yankees get special treatment. Dodgers, Red Sox, A’s too. It’s all there in the comments. It would be different if I was making it up. Modern Angel fans have this inferiority complex that fascinates me.

DowningDude
Super Member
1 month ago
Reply to  Marcotor

Not sure how many other communities you participate on … But i only post here. I tend to think all communities say the same thing and it’s not just an Angel fan thing. Every fanbase likely has the same complaint about the umpires. You can get over that now and stop hating your fellow Angel fans.

WE’RE ON THE SAME TEAM, BUDDY.

gitchogritchoffmypettis
Super Member
Reply to  DowningDude

Dude, I will shit gold when ever I read a fan on any site (most likely a Yankee fan) just plop down a “Hey guys, I think it’s pretty cool how, if you pay attention, you can see the umpires kinda favor our team. Dat’s how great we are!”

DowningDude
Super Member
1 month ago
Reply to  Marcotor

holy mackerel, bro!!!!!!comment image

DowningDude
Super Member
1 month ago
Reply to  DowningDude

22 instances from 2012 to 2020 when you stopped posting at HH (good on you man – Me too)

bradllee424
Trusted Member
1 month ago
Reply to  MarineLayer

It has everything thing to do with Moreno and Carpino. I can’t stand either one of those people.

Fansince1971
Super Member
1 month ago

Dodgers and Giants are playing great baseball in a pennant race for the ages. Too bad they don’t play each other those last 3 games of the season.

Imagine if it were the days before the wildcard and one of them would miss the playoffs entirely!

MarineLayer
Trusted Member
1 month ago
Reply to  Fansince1971

If would be nice if both of them could miss the playoffs.

steelgolf
Super Member
1 month ago
Reply to  MarineLayer

I’m fine with The Giants, and have gone to two of their home games this season. Great park and fun team to watch.

red floyd
Super Member
1 month ago
Reply to  steelgolf

My NL team is the Padres.

gitchogritchoffmypettis
Super Member
Reply to  MarineLayer

True dat. The seeth that comes off the Doyer fanbase is gold and it’s not like there’s any solid reason to hate the Giants unless you really work at it.

red floyd
Super Member
1 month ago
Reply to  MarineLayer

The enemy of my enemy is my enemy’s enemy. Nothing more and nothing less. He may or may not be my ally.

Charles Sutton
Editor
Trusted Member
1 month ago

I predict that grievance hearing will be neither short nor sweet.

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