LA Angels Monday News Crash: Ohtani Deal

Shohei Ohtani made a one year deal with the Angels for $30 Million to avoid arbitration in 2023.

Tommy LaStella is done for the season with neck spasms. Logn Webb. also of the Giants, went on the 15 day IL with lower back stiffness. The Mariners are looking to activate Julio Rodriguez today. Eric Hosmer is also looking to be activated today.

In the wake of Jerry DiPoto being elevated to POBO, Justin Hollander is now the General Manager for the Mariners.

Tony LaRussa is expected to announce his retirement today.

Albert Pujols tied Babe Ruth for runs batted in on his 702nd home run.

Photo credit: Rex Fregosi

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Eric_in_Portland
Legend
1 year ago

I’m one of those who doesn’t care if we pick 8th or 15th if we have good scouting. The higher picks aren’t necessarily going to make it to the majors. But for those who want us to have a “better” pick, we’re currently in a 3 way tie so we could be 10th, 11th, or 12th by the end of tonight.

BannedInLA
Super Member
1 year ago

Baseball has something like 600 rounds in the draft, so yeah, we should pick better.

We should also sign better FA’s. That would be nice.

GrandpaBaseball
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  BannedInLA

Yup, 20 rounds can seem awful long indeed.

2GA2Join
Super Member
1 year ago

I agree with everyone who says that we need to do good scouting, and good development, to make any draft pick turn out good, no matter what # picks we have.

However, I do believe that our chance for getting franchise-altering talent increases as we pick higher. If we’re looking at a super talented player we want and he gets picked 2 slots before us, well then we didn’t have the opportunity to control our own destiny and pick that good player. Whether or not we would have developed him correctly or not would have been an issue that came after picking him.

FungoAle
Legend
1 year ago

EIP, what is the tie breaker and who would get it if the Angels finish in a 3-way tie? Playing the As, Angels should at least win 2 out of 3. Sandy should win tonight and Ohtani’s game is a win for sure.

Cubs just stumbled against the Reds. D-Backs play the Brewers.

BannedInLA
Super Member
1 year ago

Incredibly interesting lineup tonight.

Soto leading off, Rendon at 3rd and Fletcher over Rengifo.

Me thinks that this is probably what the lineup could very well look like on opening day 2023 – 1B being the biggest question.

Eric_in_Portland
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  BannedInLA

with O’Hoppe catching

BannedInLA
Super Member
1 year ago

Considering that our other option is Max Stassi, I think the Angels would love to believe in O’Hoppe heading into to 2023.

It would also reduce the “to do” list during the offseason.

Mia
Legend
Mia
1 year ago
Reply to  Cowboy26

Really liking this kid.

gitchogritchoffmypettis
Legend
Reply to  Cowboy26

AH NAH RENDAWN! MAH MUSH ROOMDICK AHR ANGER! AH HAY IT HUM! HE GOT MUH HONEY AN MAH WUHIVES EX LOOKA LIKE HIM! HE TINX HE COOL BUTT NO NOT SO! ALL WEY HURDT ALL HIM FAULT AHR TEH! GERRIT COLE SINGN TO MAH HOLE! YAH YAH DAGOBAH!

FungoAle
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  Cowboy26

THIS…is a good line-up. Book-it, Angels get the W.

DowningDude
Legend
1 year ago

comment image

gitchogritchoffmypettis
Legend
Reply to  DowningDude

AH MAH GIRD DAZALL AHR TEH CARE ABOW! NAH WINNING! AH DEE SPICE ARE TEH!

Mia
Legend
Mia
1 year ago
Reply to  DowningDude

“The party told you to reject the evidence of your eyes and ears. It was their final, most essential command.”

Last edited 1 year ago by Mia
BannedInLA
Super Member
1 year ago
Reply to  Mia

2 + 2 = 5

JackFrost
Super Member
1 year ago
Reply to  Mia

Is that quote from “1984” ?

RexFregosi
Super Member
1 year ago

nashing the pearly gates.

Nash Walters impending MLB debut.

New kid, added to the club tonight and the 40-man a few weeks ago. He was a brewer.

Cowboy26
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  RexFregosi

Theres also a Nashing of teeth over that AAA 6.75 ERA.

DowningDude
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  Cowboy26

GnashingthePearlyWhites dot com.

RexFregosi
Super Member
1 year ago

Runs scored in 2022: 616

Looking at previous seasons- this is about as inept as it gets for this team.

Only worsier seasons? Non strike years-

1992, then back in the 70’s

FungoAle
Legend
1 year ago

Seeing that Pujols tied the Babe feels like a gut punch

JackFrost
Super Member
1 year ago
Reply to  FungoAle

I think it’s cool. The Babe was and is overrated.

Last edited 1 year ago by JackFrost
clover_black
Super Member
1 year ago
Reply to  JackFrost

my face just melted off from this hot take

JackFrost
Super Member
1 year ago
Reply to  clover_black

The competition that Mays and Aaron played against was much better.

Being a lovable, fat white dude who played for the Yankees always gave him an advantage in terms of how he is viewed by posterity. He is generally considered the greatest baseball player ever but I don’t see it that way.

Could Babe do the things Trout has done in the first half of his career? I think not. And don’t get me started on the Shohei/Babe comparisons; Ohtani blows him out of the water.

Last edited 1 year ago by JackFrost
2GA2Join
Super Member
1 year ago
Reply to  JackFrost

Wow, I totally agree with you.

I think if there was a time machine, and we nabbed Ruth and brought him here, first we’d let him calm down from freaking out about time travel.
Then once calm, he could play ball. And I think that Ohtani would strike Ruth out on 3 pitches. And at the same time, I think Ohtani would place Ruth’s first pitch into the bleachers.

The athleticism and pitching quality has advanced big time since Ruth’s time. I have no doubt that Ruth was the greatest of his time, (in his segregated league too). But if he played now, I don’t know how well he’d do. So I think it is tricky when we talk about players being “the greatest ever”…. it is problematic.

FungoAle
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  2GA2Join

Oh hell yeah, bunch of “Plummers and Firemen” back when Ruth played, JJ Reddick talk.

I’m against substance abuse to propel stat lines.

gitchogritchoffmypettis
Legend
Reply to  2GA2Join

Ummmmm…. yeah. Guys like Lefty Grove, Pete Alexander, Burleigh Grimes, Waite Hoyt…. I don’t give a shit that there were no players of color, or that it was the 20s. Those guys, then, would have pitched twice the innings, drunk twice the whisky, and struck out twice the hackers who are hitting today…. then beat the shit out of anyone who looked cross eyed at them. Today? If a guy like Lefty Grove got trained up in today’s game, with today’s food etc? Sheeeet.

Same with the hitters. Shit I’d love to see a candy ass like Trout have to deal with Ty Cobb. People act like, because Ruth was fat, he didn’t have a 340 lifetime BA, or that a guy who had to work as a fireman in the off season because the game paid shit was less skilled than “modern guy” who is pampered for life but can’t hit the other way if it would save his kid.

Those really good players back then would still tear it up now, and I just don’t believe even the scrubs, pre-expansion/integration, were that much worse than Magnanimous Sierra is today. Maybe a little, but not to the point where I’m saying something stupid like “Ohtani makes Babe Ruth look like a hobo.”

And I’m a guy who thinks Mays was the best ever.

Last edited 1 year ago by gitchogritchoffmypettis
2GA2Join
Super Member
1 year ago

Well, I didn’t say he’d look like a hobo, to be fair.

Just that I think the skill levels are somewhat disparate.

It is interesting as I read through replies that there are some noticeable differences of opinion on this stuff.
I remember I made a similar point like this in some other forum, and there was a guy who seemed to completely come unhinged at my suggestion that Ruth wasn’t the greatest ever in history and that no one could compare ever.

GrandpaBaseball
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  2GA2Join

Today’s hitters are not as good, and they are bigger, faster and stronger. Fielding is better mainly because of the gloves that are giant sized, and the fields are perfect. Pitching has changed because of the speed of the FB. Ruth in his prime was a very good RF’er with a great arm, hit even the dead ball farther than anyone else, the live ball farther and more often and while he was thought today to be fat, he was all muscle. He had a long career even not taking care of himself. GOAT, to each his own, but GPB will go to his grave believing that Ruth was the GOAT.

2GA2Join
Super Member
1 year ago

Fair enough.
Honestly, I think the big difference is in the pitching, anyway. I think the advancement in what pitchers today do (the arsenal) far surpasses what they did back then.
As a data point, why did so many “old days” pitchers do 32 complete games in a season, etc etc? It isn’t that today’s pitchers have suddenly gone weak, and they are all devolving. It is because the torque and stress on the arms is so much more than in the “old days” because of what they throw.
So I think that if Ruth faced today’s pitchers, he’d be like “whoa what was that?” as he struck out.
And if he tried to pitch to today’s hitters who are all accustomed to way better pitching, he’d get smoked.

GrandpaBaseball
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  2GA2Join

If Ruth was born in 2000 and was going today just starting out, he would pitch only if he had the stuff similar to Ohtani. If he were hitting, he would do better than average. But to compare what we only know about to today’s game cannot be done. Ted and Stan dominated the 40’s and Willie and Aaron the late 50’s and 60’s, but I cannot tell what they would do today. (My money would be that today’s rip roarin’ pitchers would get hammered).

Doing the what if is fun and no one is right or wrong, because the game is different with each decade of time.

Ohtani is a great pitcher based on today’s hitters, the same hitters who strikeout at numbers never seen before and do not know how to hit, whether based on skill or learning what is coming next. Is today’s pitching going to top the 1920’s hitting? I just don’t have an answer.

But your opinion is just as good as any other.

BannedInLA
Super Member
1 year ago

Great response.

Eric_in_Portland
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  2GA2Join

sure, if there was a time machine. But if Ruth were born in 1990 he’d be a much healthier Babe, a much taller Babe. This is the old “if the Wright Brothers were so smart why didn’t they build a jet?” argument.

gitchogritchoffmypettis
Legend

Exactly. Walter Johnson (likely) threw 100 MPH over far far more innings per season than De Gromme pulls off per year for longer than just about any current pitcher will and he grew up eating grass and saw dust and horse and shit. No way he was letting random dudes massage him, and training? No sir. That’s for weirdos…. just go hunting in the winter. He’d be a beast if he was born in 1990.

MarineLayer
Super Member
1 year ago
Reply to  2GA2Join

If we signed him to the Angels, he regress from his norms, and then get injured.

BannedInLA
Super Member
1 year ago
Reply to  2GA2Join

This is a great debate. I don’t have anything better to add so I’ll enjoy the back & forth like a tennis match.

2GA2Join
Super Member
1 year ago
Reply to  BannedInLA

Why are you just sitting there not helping?
If you aren’t going to add anything, then at least make yourself useful and build us the time machine we need to settle this debate please.

gitchogritchoffmypettis
Legend
Reply to  JackFrost

Easy there homer

Last edited 1 year ago by gitchogritchoffmypettis
FungoAle
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  JackFrost

What does Ruth being “white” have anything to do with this?

DowningDude
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  FungoAle

The Babe might be like Paul MacAnulty if he came back today.

JackFrost
Super Member
1 year ago
Reply to  DowningDude

😂 😂

Jeff Joiner
Editor
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  FungoAle

For one he couldn’t have played in MLB otherwise. Secondly, baseball has always had a pretty pale fan base and let’s be honest ethnic pride in sports was much more prevalent in Ruth’s day.

JackFrost
Super Member
1 year ago
Reply to  FungoAle

ALOT ! It has to do with an unconscious (and sometimes conscious!) bias by American media types towards white players through much of the first half of the 20th century and sometimes later as well. This bias played into the mythology of Ruth and the way he was written about… This in turn influenced public perception over time. So yeah, it has alot to do with how he was and is perceived.

I think race and racial stereotypes has alot to do with why Aaron and Mays are generally not viewed to be the greater player.

Last edited 1 year ago by JackFrost
gitchogritchoffmypettis
Legend
Reply to  JackFrost

The way it tends to work for me is I think Mays is the greatest, and I tend to think it’s by a wide margin…. then I look at Ruth’s career and am like, “Oh, shit. He was really friggin good.” Not as good as Mays over all, but I tend to forget how good he was because he was a fat Yankee in a stacked line up.

2002heaven
Super Member
1 year ago
Reply to  JackFrost

Ruth vs Cobb
was the rivalry back then.

Jeff Joiner
Editor
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  JackFrost

Agreed. The level of play in Ruth’s day was abysmal. The best teams in the country were in the Ivy League and the players on those teams went to more lucrative careers on Wall Street rather than play baseball.

On top of the color line, there were no formal minor leagues.

By the time Mays and Aaron were playing the talent pool was much larger and that talent was proven through layers of minor league development.

There’s no comparison.

I greatly thank Ruth for growing this game I love. I easily recognize him as the greatest of his era. But to call him the GOAT is impossible.

Mikeal1st
Trusted Member
1 year ago
Reply to  Jeff Joiner

Great point

JackFrost
Super Member
1 year ago
Reply to  Jeff Joiner

Well stated Jeff.

Eric_in_Portland
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  Jeff Joiner

you know I’ll always disagree with you. Back then baseball was THE game. All boys played it. Now the players we have are the ones who’ve chosen it over football and basketball. For all we know the game is weaker today because the best athletes are in other sports.

And of course there were only 16 teams, the 400 best (white) players. It’s absurd (I think) to say if 125 were Latino and 35 were African-American (those represent our current percentages) that Ruth would have been shut out by those players. I believe his HR total would be less, as it would have been for all, but not substantially less. There’s a myth that the Negro League stars were all as good as Josh Gibson, Oscar Charleston et al and that they would have dominated 1920s/1930s/1940s baseball. The stars would have been great, the Negro League scrubs would possibly have been a little better than the white MLB scrubs.

Plus it’s also silly to look at the fat Babe at the end of his career and ignore what he looked like early on.

And where did you get the idea that the best (white) baseball players were Ivy League? Perhaps football players but I’ve never heard anyone say it of baseball players. And the good Ivy Leaguers turned pro, anyway, like Gehrig.

GrandpaBaseball
Legend
1 year ago

Babe Ruth was the Greatest of all time because he did things that no one did in the game. I believe too that it is impossible to compare eras or even decades to each other. The Ball Parks changed, the field conditions changed, the strategy changed, the baseball itself changed, gloves changed, the pitcher’s mound has changed, umpiring has changed, night baseball was added.

It has taken over a hundred years of MLB evolution to change the game to what it is today. So yes, because he was the first of his kind and 100 years later many of his records still stand and the ones that fell to being still in top ten of all the events still makes him the best.

Because people of color were not allowed was wrong today and seems pretty stupid to us does not water down what was accomplished then. It does make what Branch Rickey and Jackie Robinson pulled off look more remarkable and notable in the time period that it came to be, and we all have befitted from it in both the sport and society, but again that does not change what Ruth accomplished.

My favorite MLB player of all time rankings changes with time but Mickey Mantle and Mike Trout are up there. The players hated to see whip the Dodgers and Angels and I just hoped would not kill us where Mickey Mantle, Willie’s-Mays and McCovey, Hank Aaron, Roberto Clemente and Willie Stargell, Yaz and Brooks, Killibrew and Oliva and I never saw the color of their skin make them better than the rest. The 1960’s was my favorite decade because I saw so many of the GOST players. Pitchers back then were in my years of 8 thur !7 just as much Baseball Gods as the hitters, Koufax Drysdale, Chance, Gibson, McClain, Seaver, and so many more.
But Baseball is not the same today as it was then and the ’60’s were not like the ’20’s.

Some of you have different views than I, that’s OK too, and opinions will vary, and I respect that too, I also respect what came long before me and I see that there may be weaknesses, but my father told me he always thought the ’50’s and ’60’s were his favorite MLB years, just to point out that we all think a bit differently. Have a good Evening.

gitchogritchoffmypettis
Legend
Reply to  Jeff Joiner

Yah, Ruth was awesome, but I think both Mays and Ted Williams were better. Maybe Frank Robinson too.

MarineLayer
Super Member
1 year ago
Reply to  JackFrost

Jack, do you remember the years where Babe Ruth individually hit more HR’s than most other teams. He was awesome.

Cowboy26
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  MarineLayer

Yep with 50 ounce bats and 500 feet power alleys. This roid raged pikers now a days couldn’t carry his bat to the plate even with 2 people.

The Bambino gets a bad rap. I would have loved to see him play against the best of the day and from what I understand he did just that during a shit pile of barnstorming against the negro league during many MLB offseasons.

JackFrost
Super Member
1 year ago
Reply to  MarineLayer

He dominated a league with weaker overall competitive levels. Like Jeff said, he was the best in his era, but that does not make him the GOAT.

FungoAle
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  JackFrost

It is a long standing record being tied by a guy who enhanced his performance. Nothing cool about it to me. The numbers are there, no matter how much you try to dissolve his relevancy. Take your marbles and go home.

JackFrost
Super Member
1 year ago
Reply to  FungoAle

Lol. You were the one who started this… Did you expect everyone to just passively agree with you ?

BannedInLA
Super Member
1 year ago
Reply to  JackFrost

It’s counter productive to compare players from vastly different era’s due
to multiple factors.

Though I do agree that Shoehei is the best “baseball player” ever. Period.

Cowboy26
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  FungoAle

714?

DowningDude
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  Charles Sutton

714 tickets.

Jeff Joiner
Editor
Legend
1 year ago

Just to do the math here:

Justin Upton 2022 pay: $28 million
Shohei Ohtani 2022 pay: $5.5 million

Ohtani alone in 2023: $30 million

So for all those dreaming of the Justin Upton money being used to bring in a shortstop or an ace or something, that dream is now dead if Ohtani is kept.

However, at $8 million per WAR the new Ohtani deal means he has about $50 million in surplus trade value. That would bring in a couple of MLB ready pieces no problem.

gitchogritchoffmypettis
Legend
Reply to  Jeff Joiner

YAR BAH EWE NO TARDEM BADE ROOT! ALL EEN ARTEH DO IT MEOW!

Jeff Joiner
Editor
Legend
1 year ago

I guess I can give it away now, I’m 100% trading Ohtani in my “If I was Perry” piece.

gitchogritchoffmypettis
Legend
Reply to  Jeff Joiner

GNO AH EEN ARTEH DOH EAT NAH WAH? !

JackFrost
Super Member
1 year ago
Reply to  Jeff Joiner

I anxiously await to see what true Ace you are going to replace him with to fill his spot and hold top billing of our pitching staff.

DowningDude
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  JackFrost

2 Jokers for an Ace.

Jeff Joiner
Editor
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  JackFrost

I doubt I’ll find a true ace to replace him. But I will find a really good pitcher who will be here for several years and a sorely needed bat to lengthen the lineup and save enough money to fill other holes.

Really, the chances of Ohtani walking after next year and the Angels receiving nothing but a draft pick is just too high for me.

We can’t get another Ohtani. But if we are likely to lose him anyway, let’s get some quality pieces for him before he goes.

2GA2Join
Super Member
1 year ago
Reply to  Jeff Joiner

Absolutely.

RexFregosi
Super Member
1 year ago
Reply to  Jeff Joiner

absolutely wouldn’t trade him in the winter/spring.

of course, if he hasn’t signed an extension by August, i’m sure if he’s performing like he is this year, he’d get a very decent return if we arent playoff bound ourselves.

some one will pay for a #1 starter and his bat even for a rental.

gitchogritchoffmypettis
Legend
Reply to  JackFrost

Why do we need to replace him with a true ace NEXT YEAR? What if the plan is we trade Ohtani, get a bunch of “future stuff”, and you get to suck it and watch a team with no ace… or root for the Dodgers….?

Jayman28
Trusted Member
1 year ago

I choose the third option: root for the Padres

gitchogritchoffmypettis
Legend
Reply to  Jayman28

GO REDS!…… oh

admkir
Trusted Member
1 year ago
Reply to  Jeff Joiner

Jeff, it looks as if you are starting your annual if I were PTP,.
So I want to help a little, since you have reallocated the Upton money.

First I had read a recent story (can’t remember source) that they would let Ohtani pitch in a 5 man rotation.

Now to the money and my figures are rough, the Upton money to Ohtani actually frees up 3.5 m. You will be gaining 21 m from Thor and about 16 m from D-cell. You’ll get about 2 m from Suzuki and 6.75 m from Lorenzen. This frees up around 50 m minus arbs.

If they do go to a 5 man rotation you will need another starter. If everyone comes back healthy I would be happy with a stopgap at ss but would want better in lf and better depth.

Okay I’ve said too much, just food for thought

gitchogritchoffmypettis
Legend
Reply to  admkir

It will be pretty hilarious if, since he plans to sell anyway, he just doesn’t spend those “extra” millions from those expiring/traded contracts. Why would he?

Jeff Joiner
Editor
Legend
1 year ago

Or he could sign Ohtani for big money but backload the hell out of the deal like Loria did with Stanton.

A new $400 million deal would wipe out the 1 year settlement. Arte could pay Ohtani $10 million and let the next guy worry about the $390.

2GA2Join
Super Member
1 year ago
Reply to  Jeff Joiner

I really really would like to see Arte sign Ohtani before he sells, but alas I don’t think he will.
He might make no meaningful additions to the team this offseason (except for the usual 1 FA pitcher for a 1 year $14MM pillow deal), and call it a wrap.
Then we’ll absolutely suck again next year, and Ohtani will leave, and we’ll have nothing to show for him except for a compensatory pick. And that’s where the new owner will start.

RexFregosi
Super Member
1 year ago
Reply to  Jeff Joiner

Two ‘MLB ready’ players sounds like ‘two 8-7 pitchers’.

Though I’d never trade Shohei, I’m thinking two MLB all-stars. (Alvarez/Altuve for Shohei? 🤔) Shohei himself is two All-Stars.

Shohei, Rendon, and Trout are elite and the three best players on this team and getting to the playoffs in 2023 is the immediate goal and I just can’t see how trading these 3 guys away makes the club better. That’s my core, build around it.

gitchogritchoffmypettis
Legend
Reply to  RexFregosi

First: You live in a fantasy land and will not be getting close to what you want when we trade Shohei.

Second: We get several young players. And we get out of paying Shohei 500M…. that’s a big plus.

DowningDude
Legend
1 year ago

But then we’d lose out on Ippei!!!!

Jayman28
Trusted Member
1 year ago
Reply to  RexFregosi

Depends on what the new ownership wants, we can just speculate or do the hope and faith bit. We just won’t know what their plan is.

Maybe they go with the Rockies plan (awful plan btw): let Shohei stay one more year and let his contract expire, if they don’t make the playoffs again, then they do the Rockies’ fan cope post they do everytime they lose a player to free agency instead of trading them and getting some value in return, you know, the “but at least we didn’t let the other team win” bit.

Last edited 1 year ago by Jayman28
Jeff Joiner
Editor
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  RexFregosi

We’re not getting two all stars for 1 year of a guy making $30 million next year.

We did have 13 different players start in left field this year. Those 13 guys accumulated negative WAR.

We have no middle infield depth at all. We had Mayfield, Wade, and Squid in the same lineup at times this year. Even one of them is too much.

What if we added an outfielder with a 120 OPS+ who is cost controlled for 4 years and a legit infielder who could cover 2B, 3B, and SS and put up 6 WAR this year and is cost controlled for three more? Let’s say they throw in a good pitching prospect too.

Now we have a much deeper lineup and $28 million to spend on pitching. And considering we only need 5 starters now and have some stud relief arms on the way, that means we can get really good pitching.

It would suck to not see history every night. It also sucked seeing a Squid, Mayfield, Suzuki bottom of the lineup.

Last edited 1 year ago by Jeff Joiner
JackFrost
Super Member
1 year ago
Reply to  Jeff Joiner

It does not make sense to pay him $30 million and then turn around and trade him. If that wanted to trade him they could just have done it this off-season instead of giving him the contract over arbitration. I don’t know the exact rules of when arbitration must be finished or if it has to be completed prior to trades, but I just don’t see why they do this now if they don’t plan to keep him through 2023 and at least TRY to keep him beyond that.

I hope we get an owner willing to make the investment. I don’t agree with others that say the rest of the team will be crap, especially since we appear to have some good cost controlled pitching in Sandoval, Suarez, Herget etc..

Last edited 1 year ago by JackFrost
gitchogritchoffmypettis
Legend
Reply to  JackFrost

“It does not make sense to pay him $30 million and then turn around and trade him.”

Yes. It does. Think about it, you’ll see why.

Jeff Joiner
Editor
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  JackFrost

I actually think the opposite. With the contract out of the way early it paved the way for a trade.

Teams know exactly what he’ll cost them and can set their packages accordingly.

JackFrost
Super Member
1 year ago
Reply to  Jeff Joiner

Yeah, but that is ONLY for 2023. What he gets next season really has no impact for other teams who would want to sign him to a long term deal. I think it is good for the Angels for reasons I explained yesterday or Saturday; namely, avoid the unpleasantness of arbitration, and, it shows the Angels respect what he has done for them. Maybe, it paves the way for a future negotiation.

But any team trading for him would certainly want him for more than half a season in 2023.

Last edited 1 year ago by JackFrost
gitchogritchoffmypettis
Legend
Reply to  Jeff Joiner

This. I want this. Plus we can use the DH spot as a tool, sign a depth/platoon piece to pair with Walsh and play DH and maybe another spot as well.

DowningDude
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  Jeff Joiner

Mayfield was awesome – player of the game once:
comment image

Senator_John_Blutarsky
Legend
Reply to  Jeff Joiner

The only hope at this point is to back up the Brinks truck, borrow money from MNT and Bobby Bonilla, and pay Sho. If you don’t pay him, the trade value goes down since he’s a one-season rental.

gitchogritchoffmypettis
Legend

PEOPLE! We need to be accurate and respectful of the clearly distinct and very very important differences between the FO positions in baseball. They are what define a team’s ability to win or lose and encapsulate why AndrArte is the most vile creature ever to stalk the earth, forcing players to suck for too much money and killing off junkies while starving MiLB players to death as they sleep on wet cement slabs. Plus Republican. Turible.

Hollander escaped the evil and is now MUCH more than a GM. He is Executive Vice President & General Manager of Baseball Operations. Or EVPNGMOBO. Now, of course, he doesn’t have the planet crushing ability to keep an owner completely uninvolved with roster decisions and running a farm system while, at the same time, being so single minded about baseball and only baseball that he actually hates turning a profit and forces the entire marketing department to have a sock in their mouth while in the building. POBOs don’t even have comforters or blankets on their bed. They just have sheets and then championship trophies keep them warm at night.

Now, an EVPNGMOBO doesn’t have THAT level of midachlorian concentration. But he’s still TOTALLY different from a mere GM and is TOTALITARIANLY TOTALLY doing different stuff than when he was Vice President & Assistant General Manager of Baseball Operations… which is vastly different than just an AGM. He has POBO powers, but they are clamped in a vice, so weaker.

Trust me. If you read the link it will go on to explain that these titles are for far far more than just keeping FO guys from getting poached by other teams to just do the same job for more money and Arte Moreno is an asshole.

toad2065
Trusted Member
1 year ago

After a lot of serious contemplation (about 2 minutes), I hereby nominate you sir for the newest award. Site MEM! (Most Entertaining Member). Congratulations, Gitch!

gitchogritchoffmypettis
Legend
Reply to  toad2065

comment image

Last edited 1 year ago by gitchogritchoffmypettis
DowningDude
Legend
1 year ago

comment image

gitchogritchoffmypettis
Legend
Reply to  DowningDude

ooops…burp….

DowningDude
Legend
1 year ago

just added an “S” to your http and it fixed it.

Cowboy26
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  toad2065

Yep. He’s definitely the site’s biggest member

gitchogritchoffmypettis
Legend
Reply to  Cowboy26

I was gonna post an image and the….. nope….

smithy610
Super Member
1 year ago

I’m cautiously optimistic about Livan Soto. I think he still needs time in the minors, and maybe the book on him is totally not out yet, since he’s not a blue-chip prospect who was scouted to death, and maybe that’s why he’s surprisingly doing well on offense, but he can be a good bench piece next year to spell Fletcher and/or Rengifo.

Cautiously optimistic because I still remember Parker Bridwell.

MarineLayer
Super Member
1 year ago
Reply to  smithy610

Since I already see Rengifo as a bench piece, I was hoping Soto could leapfrog him.

Trout_is_my_Bestie
Member
1 year ago
Reply to  smithy610

I don’t see why you’re only cautiously optimistic. He’s hitting over .400 with an OPS over 1.000

If that doesn’t tell you that he’s overtaken Trout and Shohei as the best player in baseball, I don’t know what will.

For my plan for 2023, I’d pencil him in at short and count on him producing this stellar offensive output.

GM’ing is so easy!

gitchogritchoffmypettis
Legend

WE DID IT!

Cowboy26
Legend
1 year ago

Hell yeah. hes already taken over as the best Soto in all of baseball.

Last edited 1 year ago by Cowboy26
DowningDude
Legend
1 year ago

this is the winning post of the day.

Trout_is_my_Bestie
Member
1 year ago

Considering we have Neto waiting in the wings with a slash line of .320/.382/.492, I think it’s a no brainer putting him at second base next year.

I think each of them putting up 10 WAR next season should put us squarely in first.

gitchogritchoffmypettis
Legend

10 WAR each? Why not? Is easy.

2GA2Join
Super Member
1 year ago

Are you kidding? We have Rengifo at 2B, and he is going to continue this torrid streak into next year. Pencil in Soto and Rengifo as our #3 and #4 next year. Slackers like Ohtani and Trout can move down the lineup some.

Just put Soto at SS, Rengifo and 2B, and now we can trade away Neto, Fletch (and probably Stassi too, because now we have O’Hoppe) , and whoever else for pitching help. And I think Soto and Rengifo probably won’t get injured either, so we’ll be fine.

RexFregosi
Super Member
1 year ago
Reply to  2GA2Join

It’s clear to me, the highest hitting batting average guys right now in the line-up? Trash Pandas (Soto and O’Hoppe are the only .300 hitters we have)

We should get more Trash Pandas in the lineup.

DowningDude
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  RexFregosi

and less TRASH in the lineup.

Jeff Joiner
Editor
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  smithy610

I’m also cautiously optimistic. His bat is way better then it was in AA and most guys don’t improve as they move up levels.

That said, by the eye test he looks comfortable at the plate. Normally young guys tend to expand their zone and swing at everything. I’ve seen him spit on breaking balls in multiple at bats.

That said, the MLB level should be one legit SS/2B brought in with Fletcher and then Rengifo behind them. Soto and Neto need to be in the minors.

gitchogritchoffmypettis
Legend
Reply to  Jeff Joiner

THAT is what I’m getting excited about. Soto/Neto could wind up being a pretty potent future for us up the middle. This would also make Jackson, Peris, Fletcher, Rengifo etc possible trade fodder down the line.

rosstrade
Trusted Member
1 year ago

Looking at the overall state of the Angels as a franchise, the only good thing that I can say about Arte Moreno is that he has nice hair….

DowningDude
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  rosstrade

He looked like an actual fish out of water Saturday night. Hope he’s doing ok. I took some selfies in front of his car for JackFrost.

DowningDude
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  DowningDude

cropped myself out for privacy …
comment image

HI JACK!
Love, Arturo Moreno’s Car

gitchogritchoffmypettis
Legend
Reply to  DowningDude

??? Naw. Arte arrives at the Big A in a black luxury coach lit with red lanterns drawn by two huge black horses in gleaming black armor driven by a tall, slender man in a hooded black cloak. Usually with a dead hooker in the other seat, grasping a jar of torn elbow tendons his surgeons set aside for him as trophies from his turible nightscapades.

This is Gubi’s car.

DowningDude
Legend
1 year ago

 😂 

JackFrost
Super Member
1 year ago
Reply to  DowningDude

Lol.

I never said it wasn’t his car.

DowningDude
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  JackFrost

 😘 

2002heaven
Super Member
1 year ago
Reply to  DowningDude

comment image
Jerry Jones yacht
Nice!!!

Last edited 1 year ago by 2002heaven
DowningDude
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  DowningDude

I never noticed how forlornly Jared Walsh was looking out at Arte’s car.

DowningDude
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  DowningDude

comment image

gitchogritchoffmypettis
Legend
Reply to  DowningDude

Walsh always looks like he’s considering all the ways WWI could have been avoided.

tommyshalo
Trusted Member
1 year ago

Walsh reminds me of Marcus Aurelius and his sad philosophy.
comment image.

2002heaven
Super Member
1 year ago
Reply to  DowningDude

comment image?w=780
Logan Roy Succession TV series

RexFregosi
Super Member
1 year ago
Reply to  rosstrade

He does have nice hair, probably no owner in sports has nicer hair than Arte.

He also has a nice car. He’s been driving those black S-class Benz ever since he’s been owner. He’d always pull up in Tempe in it.

I wonder how often he upgrades? Has he had more Benz’s or GMs as owner?

Arte has some other nice things too. His baseball team has a few bright shiny objects. I wish it had a RF.

red floyd
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  RexFregosi

GMs: Stoneman, Ninja, Jer-Jer, Billy, PTP.
I have no idea how many S-Class cars he’s had.

2002heaven
Super Member
1 year ago
Reply to  RexFregosi

Just not a POBO or GM with pervious experience.

Cowboy26
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  2002heaven

We dont want no pervious experienced POBO’s or GM’s cuz we dont want shit falling through the cracks.

DowningDude
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  RexFregosi

Remember when Matsui smashed the windshield with a deep homer in Spring Training? hahah!

Rallymanatee
Trusted Member
1 year ago

Say what you want about the Angels trAdition of playing good ball after they’re eliminated. I for one am glad to see some good games before the cold dark off season sets in.

gitchogritchoffmypettis
Legend
Reply to  Rallymanatee

Sell out.

Brent
Super Member
1 year ago

That Ohtani guy better be worth that contract.

gitchogritchoffmypettis
Legend
Reply to  Brent

Watch, the 30M threshold will strike again, like a payroll Van Allen belt. His OPS+ will drop by 60 points next year and he’ll go back to swinging with his ass out….

DowningDude
Legend
1 year ago

Knocking the helmet off his head while swinging – That’s one indicator when he’s not right.

Last edited 1 year ago by DowningDude
Marcotor
Trusted Member
1 year ago

I always wondered if that was some kind of Ichiro influence, sticking his ass out in the middle of his swing

WallyChuckChili
Legend
1 year ago

Angels activated Anthony Rendon.

Brent
Super Member
1 year ago

Angels record was 27-21 when he went out the first time (and shouldn’t have come back for that brief time before going on season ending IL). It was the 4th game of that 14 game losing streak. If he can stay healthy all season, and the releivers don’t completely suck, I think… I THINK this team can make the playoffs next season.

Senator_John_Blutarsky
Legend

Who?

Brent
Super Member
1 year ago

2019 WS Champion. The only member of the team with a ring? Wait, we have some catcher for another 3 games who also has one.

FungoAle
Legend
1 year ago

Anthony “Pulled” Tendon

MarineLayer
Super Member
1 year ago
Reply to  FungoAle

I’m sure he will be awesome-ish the last three games, although there is the risk of reinjury.

DowningDude
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  MarineLayer

 😂 

tanana40
Super Member
1 year ago

Does he start serving the five game suspension today?

Cowboy26
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  Charles Sutton

Geez were have you been?. Hes been activated for about a week now and still hasn’t made an out.

DowningDude
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  Cowboy26

And has A BETTER WAR performance than usual.

RexFregosi
Super Member
1 year ago

He is an elite MLB 3b and the third best player on this team.

I am happy to get him back.

GrandpaBaseball
Legend
1 year ago

It’s official now, The Angels have three players with 40 million a year contract. JUp off the books very soon.

Trader Gerry got a bump up, now he is just POBO Jerry and his fun times are over.

LaStella is done, put a fork in ’em. He gave us a fun time while he was here though.

No sad tears for LaRussa here. what a ride. Enjoy your retirement Tony.

Albert Poolhose Won’t be tested as MLB wants another hero to stain the MLBNHOF with big numbers through the use of modern medicine.

The West Coast Airshow stunk, the friends and family were top notch and worth every second, 97 on the boat with more booze drank in 8 hours than a Liquor Store can hold. Fun in the dun all day.

Rallymanatee
Trusted Member
1 year ago

Apparently the fun in the dun kept going till morning. 😉

Biggiswrth
Trusted Member
1 year ago
Reply to  Rallymanatee

At least we got paragraphs.

DowningDude
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  Rallymanatee

I thought Grandpa was saying “fun in the dung” but that would be a crappy thing to be having fun in.

gitchogritchoffmypettis
Legend
Reply to  DowningDude

You’re just uptight.

DowningDude
Legend
1 year ago

You spelled “upright” wrong.

gitchogritchoffmypettis
Legend
Reply to  Rallymanatee

Dun fun is the best fun….

Senator_John_Blutarsky
Legend

I believe Arte interviewed that Hollander guy before hiring PTP….

Cowboy26
Legend
1 year ago

Actually that Hollander guy was the second BFF that followed Jer Jer out the door to the Emerald City after Cervix.

The runner up to the platypus was Jared Porter. I know everyone laments about Perry but we dodged a bullet on Porter as he quickly turned out to be a fatal attraction psycho texter right after taking the Mets job. Although Porter probably would have fit right in with this chaotic organization.

MarineLayer
Super Member
1 year ago
Reply to  Cowboy26

Every time I look at Minasian I see a 12 year old Strat-o-magic nerd. To me, that’s one step above a psycho texter but several steps below an actual GM.

FungoAle
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  MarineLayer

LOL…he did look like that at Shohei’s award ceremony. Sneakers, red shit two sizes small, boyish grin looking up 12′ inches at Shohei.

MarineLayer
Super Member
1 year ago
Reply to  FungoAle

Exactly. Sometimes you just need to look the part. Trader Jerry did have the look.

gitchogritchoffmypettis
Legend
Reply to  MarineLayer

 🐮  💩 

DowningDude
Legend
1 year ago

Not a fan of the Flowbee haircut look?

Last edited 1 year ago by DowningDude
Cowboy26
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  MarineLayer

Actually Billy looked more like the part. The Jedi looked like his frankensteinian head was going to fall off his giraffe elongated neck at any moment. Kind of reminded me of Lurch.

DowningDude
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  Cowboy26

comment image

2002heaven
Super Member
1 year ago
Reply to  DowningDude

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#31st pick in 2018 MLB Draft…….we chose Jordyn Adams at #17 😠  😠  💩  😢 
AND THAT’S HOW YOU GET 7 STRAIGHT LOSING SEASONS AND ROOT FOR OHTANI AND TROUT AND NOTHING ELSE.

gitchogritchoffmypettis
Legend
Reply to  2002heaven

Eat a bag….

comment image&w=350&h=254

hockey_duckie
Member
1 year ago
Reply to  DowningDude

That’s the result when your owner decides to forego keeping the ace you acquired via trade in Greinke for OF Hambone. Oh, and we lost another first round pick by signing FA Hambone. We lost a first round pick the previous year by signing FA 1B Pujols.

After that horrendous season with the Dipoto four, Dipoto produced two more winning seasons and a post season appearance. That was the last time we saw the playoffs and had a winning season (finished over .500).

Dipoto found out the hard way that Arte doesn’t sign expensive pitchers and Dipoto started trading away positional players for young, cost controlled pitchers.

gitchogritchoffmypettis
Legend
Reply to  hockey_duckie

Wow… that’s an interesting sort of “based on some real close to events” version of how all that happened. Like when my neighbor back in the day spent an hour explaining in detail how Stalin stopped Napoleon in Russia.

It was snow.

Senator_John_Blutarsky
Legend
Reply to  Cowboy26

From the LA Times 11/3/2020:

Most of the candidates, whose interviews were confirmed by several people with knowledge of the search, have decades of experience in scouting. Dan Jennings and Billy Owens have long been considered among the game’s best talent evaluators. Logan White, Jason McLeod and Amiel Sawdaye were the architects of drafts that brought in Clayton Kershaw (White with the Dodgers), Kris Bryant (McLeod, Chicago Cubs) and Mookie Betts (Sawdaye, Boston Red Sox), among many others.

Kansas City executives Scott Sharp, JJ Picollo and Gene Watson helped build the Royals teams that went to back-to-back World Series and won the championship in 2015. Jared Porter, Ruben Amaro Jr., Bobby Evans, Michael Hill, Sawdaye, McLeod and Jennings also won World Series titles as members of the front offices in Boston (Porter and Sawdaye), Philadelphia (Amaro), San Francisco (Evans), Miami (Hill and Jennings), Chicago (McLeod and Porter) and Washington (Jennings).

Justin Hollander, a vice president and assistant general manager of baseball operations in Seattle who previously worked for the Angels’ front office, and Matt Arnold, a senior vice president and assistant general manager in Milwaukee, also have dabbled in scouting and gained experience in player development and roster construction.

Amaro, Jennings, Evans and Hill are the only ones of the 14 who have previously served as general managers. The rest have, at a minimum, attained the title of vice president.

Cowboy26
Legend
1 year ago

Geez the Times listed damn near everyone in the entire league offices except for the guy who got the job.

Thats shocking considering they’re never wrong over there.

2002heaven
Super Member
1 year ago
Reply to  Cowboy26

comment image?ve=1&tl=1
ugh!!!!

gitchogritchoffmypettis
Legend
Reply to  2002heaven

There he is, Matt Swanson. The guy who, combined with you, proves that losers hate winners at any level.

2002heaven
Super Member
1 year ago

Was tasked to travel to Latin America and don’t come back until you bring us a #1 ace SP, a BP shutdown closer, and a HOF SS.
Instead he came back with a bag of Rocky Mountain Oysters.
 😠  😠 

Last edited 1 year ago by 2002heaven
2GA2Join
Super Member
1 year ago

I like that sauce on eggs…

red floyd
Legend
1 year ago
Reply to  2GA2Join

I thought Hollander was the Happy Hooker?