LA Angels Monday News Crash: Get Paid

This article asks the question “Can free agents still get paid what they’re worth on the open market?” Maybe they are.

Rob Manfred does not agree that the Dodgers are ruining baseball. He also does not agree that Rob Manfred is ruining baseball.

Austin Voth went over to Japan, specifically the Chiba Lotte Marines. The Dodgers and utility man Enrique Hernandez agreed to a one year deal. Lefty Rob Kaminsky got a minor league deal with the Cardinals while Gavin Sheets got his minor league deal with the Padres.

Photo credit: Rex Fregosi

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halofansince1978
Super Member
1 month ago

Hopefully the Scottdale Airport plane crash didn’t involve any players.

Pineapple12
Super Member
1 month ago

Better yet it would be great if we could, ya know, stop having aviation-related tragedies.

5th plane crash in a month.

You can’t pay me enough to fly right now.

Jeff Joiner
Editor
Legend
1 month ago
Reply to  Pineapple12

15 years without one. Now one a week.

And here I am working on my fear of flying.

Twebur
Legend
1 month ago
Reply to  Jeff Joiner

Rocket launch from Vandenberg tonight.

IMG_8390
gitchogritchoffmypettis
Legend
Reply to  Twebur

This was super cool. one of the only good things left about Goleta, CA

Pineapple12
Super Member
1 month ago
Reply to  Jeff Joiner

I treaded very carefully not to make the comment political, but I wonder what’s changed 🤔..

If work asks me to get on a plane, it’s a hard no

Jeff Joiner
Editor
Legend
1 month ago
Reply to  Pineapple12

I also treaded lightly. Just stating facts.

Although in looking at the DC airport I’m shocked that didn’t happen sooner. Zero chance in flying into there.

Fansince1971
Legend
1 month ago
Reply to  Jeff Joiner

Flying is Way WAY WAY SAFER BY 100,000x than driving on California freeways.

Proper big commercial jets are super safe.

That said, you would not find me on a commuter flight or small private plane.

Last edited 1 month ago by Fansince1971
Jeff Joiner
Editor
Legend
1 month ago
Reply to  Fansince1971

Yes. I’m actually ely telling myself flying is safe rather than repeating my fear.

grichmanpoorman
Trusted Member
1 month ago
Reply to  Jeff Joiner

I’m sorry… but do you really think there were no plane crashes in 15 years in the United States? I would ask you to do a simple Google search… for the term “recency bias.” Part of the reason conspiracy theories spin out of control. Literally hundreds of people die every year in small plane accidents in the U.S. The reason everyone is sensitive/aware now is only because of the DC accident. https://injuryfacts.nsc.org/home-and-community/safety-topics/airplane-crashes/

Senator_John_Blutarsky
Legend
Reply to  Pineapple12

It’s all Arte and Boras.

gitchogritchoffmypettis
Legend

Lets go get some dudes like David Dahl, Whit Merrifield and Cal Quantrill or Marco Gonzalez on MiLB contracts with an invite and be done with it.

Jeff Joiner
Editor
Legend
1 month ago

I’d like David Robertson too. Probably a bit expensive but a solid veteran in the bullpen would be nice.

gitchogritchoffmypettis
Legend
Reply to  Jeff Joiner

Sure, why not. Wish granted.

gitchogritchoffmypettis
Legend

Tootie’s dream takes shape before his very face! Farhan Zaidi! To the Doyers! If only Joc Pederson and Avasail Garcia would throw on plumbers costumes and throw a knock at the door the script would be complete!

FungoAle
Legend
1 month ago

Farhan the Clown

GrandpaBaseball
Legend
1 month ago

Bregman is like Correa in that they were caught cheating, so the stink sticks to them. But Correa found a home and it is thought by some if not many he was over paid. Bregman is now a step slower and is not a really great player he was on track to be, and the marketplace is currently a little low right now on third basemen, maybe Rendone has a little influence after all.

gitchogritchoffmypettis
Legend

Bregman is still standing against the wall at the high school dance wishing someone would come over so he can explain to them that all the chicks at his school aren’t up to his standards and his girlfriend from a school in Arizona couldn’t make it.

Couldn’t have happened to a bigger douche.

Of course, real menz of baseball who hate Rendon would gladly pay this man we hate as much money as Rendon to replace Rendon while we pay Rendon. I do wonder, would real menz of baseball carry over hating Rendon for not being a shiny new Garrit Cole (who we totally could have had if Arte had just paid him $10 more than the Yankees per year but dad’s too cheap) onto Bregman? If Rendon is a hateful asshole for getting hurt, will a man who already is a hateful asshole become Satan on earth if he gets hurt? I am curious about the science of real baseball manhood….

The Moncada signing makes me think Rendon may have shown up washed. And it looks like he’d replace Rendon. And we already don’t like Moncada. Maybe if we sign a huge asshole and pay him a ton for years and years then we will like that guy? Like he’s our pimp but he really loves us?

Please Gah. Let’s not find out.

grichmanpoorman
Trusted Member
1 month ago

Cole grew up in Newport. I wonder if he was tempted at all to come home. Certainly would have altered the course of the franchise.

gitchogritchoffmypettis
Legend

That’s what some were assuming. He’s from California, who wouldn’t want to live in California? The answer was life long Yankees fan Garrit Cole.

FungoAle
Legend
1 month ago

If Perry really wants to piss me of again, he’ll sign Craig Kimbrel or Nick Pivetta

Angelz4ever
Super Member
1 month ago
Reply to  FungoAle

I heard him so he was keeping that in mind for all his signings.  😀 

gitchogritchoffmypettis
Legend

I really wish that I could get someone to sneak a recorder into the owners meetings when next they happen. Because, apparently, what the Dodgers are doing isn’t really a problem and the other 29 owners are all just sitting around giggling and counting their billions while not paying players to win.

Some may recall I FKIN HATE the “Owner” has 4 billion dollars and can spend it blah blah complaint. Yes. In the case of the Mets and Doyers they can. But if 3.2 Billion of those dollars are tied up in the thing that made you a billionaire, such as land and the team itself, then really you have 800M you’re working with. Usually it’s actually less. Just like a stock that has cash flow issues. The team and it’s owner aren’t that “rich” unless things get liquidated.

So the idea Manfred’s putting out there that the other owners are cool with the Dodgers, or should shut up and be cool, is silly. Even if the owners were just swimming in unspent money, then apparently that’s how baseball works. Demanding the sky be red instead of blue doesn’t do much.

I think that most players would be happy to have fewer giant pay days past age 30 if they make more from age 24-30. In broad terms, and I don’t know how exactly it will happen, if the owners want to have the players not strike, and they also don’t want to avoid bad contracts with older players, then they are gonna have to start ceding control over players and what they earn early over to the players more. If a career starts at age 22-24 and you have control over what they get paid till they are 29 or 30 and THEN you don’t want to pay them past age 30…. well, I think owners can see why a change is gonna come and how only the DoyKees type teams will benefit if they don’t change.

I still wish they would just create a system where a value is set for something like WAR at a position, say on scale, so that guys like catchers and relievers get valued compared to each other, and players get paid accordingly.

Maybe a player enters “the scale” after two seasons. Then gets some cut of some number, like 9 million per war for outfielders for example. Or 12 million per WAR for catchers, at the end of the season. So a 5 WAR OF gets 45M a year even if he’s a third year player. But guys who have a blip season, like catchers Kyle Higashioka this last year, also get paid 18M for last year…. but will also make about 3M a year for their 0.2 WAR normal back up catcher seasons. Make league minimum 2M or something. If a team doesn’t want to continue paying a player for production after his 2nd season, then he’s a FA.

That’s very very oversimplified. But it gives role players a lot more money. It also gets older players paid well if they perform even without a huge contract. But most importantly it gives all the players more control over where they go and how much they get paid sooner in their careers. And, of course, teams can feel free to sign players to contracts as early as they want to… but arbitration doesn’t happen any more. If you’re a relief pitcher with 1 WAR at the end of your third season you are getting 8M, nothing to figure out.

You’re also a free agent.

This sets a salary floor automatically and spreads that salary around a roster.

THEN maybe we can get a salary cap.

I know this idea’s a total mess…. but I’m trying to get some sort of system that will give players control sooner but gives the owners a salary cap and hopefully creates a lot more rosters full of players like Luis Rengifo making 12-20M a year but fewer Rendons making 35M a year and has even league minimum guys (even all 40 man roster guys?) making 2M a year. There’d a be a lot more player movement too….

But the Doyers are emblematic of a problem and it’s not just gonna get solved by capping the Doyer type teams, or somehow magically forcing the Twins to pay more FAs, unless you make it so a ALOT more players are getting paid more and far fewer Jon Grays are making big money. I think that if they find a way to pay Tarik Skubal more than Aaron Nola last season it will go a long way…. I mean, just look at pitcher WAR last year, basically almost all the wrong pitchers are getting paid the big money. BAh.

Roy Hobbs
Super Member
1 month ago

I have always liked pay for performance but I don’t think the players would like that. But I like your ideas and creative thinking. Mike Trout is essentially getting paid now for what he did when he wasn’t getting paid.

Eric_in_Portland
Legend
1 month ago
Reply to  Roy Hobbs

we’ve seen examples of players being benched or released (DeCinces) when they approach some milestone where they would have gotten a bonus. Basing salary on a stat will see more of that.

but let’s say, in theory, it were in place. It would have to be exponential rather than linear. A 9 WAR is worth a lot more than 3 times a 3 WAR. Something like 1 WAR = $1mil, 2 WAR = $2mil, 3 WAR = $4mil, 4 WAR = $8mil, 5 WAR = $16 mil, 6 WAR and up = $32mil. If that were the case then players on losing teams sitting at 4.9 WAR would get benched a lot.

Thinking about some of the players not liking they’re not getting the big contracts…they’re not entitled to it. If they’re not getting the big money then the market value has them lower. That’s how it is, unless there’s active collusion which isn’t the case with Bregman. Feeling they must be paid, how dare they not get paid!, is like some media owner suing because people don’t want to advertise on his app.

gitchogritchoffmypettis
Legend

Oh yeah. There’d have to be all kinds of math/money work done. Plus what happens if a guy gets injured, etc? You can’t dodge paying a guy by benching him by much if he’s getting paid by the .001 WAR and you have to pay who ever you replace him with the same amount…. unless you just want to tank your team. To “save” on payroll you’d have to openly play a bunch of crap players, not just bench a couple guys a few games.

There are about 1000 details that’d have to be sorted out on a thing like this, but it would be cool if they tried it.

gitchogritchoffmypettis
Legend
Reply to  Roy Hobbs

That was a total mess of an idea…. but there are a bunch of really smart people working in baseball, I know a few of them. I just think that if both sides found a way for the majority of players to get paid more for actual contributions to the team and fewer has beens get paid millions both owners and players (in general) would be fairly happy. I’m sure they could get to this point. Both sides would be making plenty of money, but Max Scherzer would be unhappy and that’s about it.

I wish baseball were smart enough to just say “we are gonna get finance analytics guys from fifteen teams together with analysts that the MLBPA send and figure a drastic new system out NOW so we have something to work on before a strike happens.”

But nope. “The people” will just need to “fight” for their “fair share” from those who hold the means of production. again.

toad2065
Trusted Member
1 month ago

I have long felt that the real problem relates more to long, guaranteed contracts. Make every player a free agent every year. No need for caps etc. Establish a minimum wage and let things happen. You know, kind of like the system most people live under.

FungoAle
Legend
1 month ago

Dodgers saga will sink even lower once they complete the trade for Nolan Arenado

GrandpaBaseball
Legend
1 month ago

Paying anyone ahead of future performance in sorts is really a crap shoot. How many players are worth their long-term contracts. I believe that having a cap and a floor is best for players. Players today are making bucks no matter what age they are at and the free-market system is working just fine for them. Teams were tripping over themselves to sign one outfielder this winter and another guy, a first baseman, was wondering why he did not get the big bucks and resigned with his original team-it was the marketplace, which is how it should be. Not one MLB player is under paid, they signed their contracts with no gun to their heads. I don’t think that I really care about what monies they make or don’t make as MLB players make more than most in professional sports do.

NBA attendance has been reported to have maxed out and the trend is pointing downward. Price has a lot to do with that you would have to believe. The marketplace may shift in baseball too, after all, is Shohei worth the money he signed for in the long run? Who knows really, but I do believe that the Dodgers down the road will crash and burn with how they are operating currently. Besides, is Rengifo really worth 20 million per year? as “Kevin” once said “I don’t think so”. (Home Alone)

gitchogritchoffmypettis
Legend

If 1 War is worth 8 million, then yes, Rengifo’s worth some cash some years. The way I was putting it, players without a long term contract would be getting a larger minimum (say 3-4M a year) for being on the roster. Then at the end of the year they get paid by WAR. Then it resets for the next season. Players not under contract who have two years of being on a 25 man roster are either signed to longer contracts OR they become FAs and can sign with another team.

BUT there is a salary cap. So players can’t all sign in LA, and they also have to consider where they will get playing time. So a guy who can play OF will be more drawn to a team like Cleveland than playing a bench role for the Dodgers…. at least in theory.

GrandpaBaseball
Legend
1 month ago

At some point the Dodgers have to pay the piper with what they are doing. Even stretching out the payments for some they are paying huge penalties now and when players are retired and still getting paid it will count as active payroll, so that hamstrings the team just like Trout and Rendon do to us. Will be interesting in a few years to see where this all works out. Do other teams copy the Dodgers and Mets? Although I understand that Soto’s deal is not set up like Shohei’s deal. But I still think that MLB needs hard caps top and bottom to save themselves and the fans.

Marcotor
Trusted Member
1 month ago

No, it won’t.

Deferrals today are not like the Scherzer deal where the Nats are still paying him $15 million a year until 2028. Mark Walter has a day job – making money.

The Basic Agreement requires teams to fund future payments today at whatever the projected (reduced) value it is. So… Ohtani’s 47MM that needs to be funded – is funded this year, not 11 years from now from the Dodger revenue of 2035. Arte was offered the same deal. And passed.

Please allow me to apologize for any inconvenience caused, as I know this takes away another reason to sad-sack, but those huge deferrals are not going to “saddle future payrolls” with anything.

Twebur
Legend
1 month ago
Reply to  Marcotor

I openly admit my math skills are embarrassingly poor, but I have a feeling that the mega rich teams benefit from this arrangement more than the “majority poor” teams.

How about we just make a new league rule and pay the man his $70,000,000 per year like almost every other MLB contract is paid? No more deferred payments, period. If the Tampa Rays, or the Twins implements this arrangement on a future mega deal, I’ll be the first to say I was wrong, and accept this is the new way forward.

Or at least lie to me and call it a “reverse signing bonus” like they do in the NFL (Most NFL singing bonuses aren’t paid in full, it’s over many years). This allows the Cash Rich owners to have an advantage. They can sign someone to a deal and give a chunk of it as a bonus, that affects the cap differently, kicking the salary can down the road. But that’s within a firm salary cap. And the cap goes up every year about 8%.

And Like if Arte only would have offered him the same, he might have stayed with the Angels……..right.

Angelz4ever
Super Member
1 month ago

“It’s beginning to look a lot like baseball….”

Let’s go diamond action in Arizona!!

Twebur
Legend
1 month ago

Man – Fred

and my email certainly reflects it: there are fans in other markets who are concerned about their team’s ability to compete, and we always have to be concerned when our fans are concerned about something.

Translation/Truth for any fan that cares or is paying attention.

The vast majority of fans in almost every market agree their team can’t compete financially. And we don’t plan any plan any further revenue sharing or a salary cap.

He might as well said, I got an email from a dude that complained their team couldn’t compete.

Jeff Joiner
Editor
Legend
1 month ago

Pitchers and catchers report this week.

NCAA starts on Friday.

Baseball is finally coming back

HalosFanForLife
Super Member
1 month ago

So Rex, you ready? We’re all like dogs on a waxy floor anticipating your AZ posts.

RexFregosi
Super Member
1 month ago

yes, it will be interesting to see how much the new clubhouse changes things. There are so many new pitchers this year.

halofansince1978
Super Member
1 month ago

Stupid Bowl is over…time for BASEBALL!!

Angelz4ever
Super Member
1 month ago

Now that the Neanderthal Felons League has ended, now we can all move on.

Pineapple12
Super Member
1 month ago

NBA + March Madness + start of MLB is my favorite time of the year!

Let’s get it

Jeff Joiner
Editor
Legend
1 month ago
Reply to  Pineapple12

Boxing and college basketball for me.

My ideal spring training trip is college conference tournament week. Day games of baseball with hoops on tv at night.

GrandpaBaseball
Legend
1 month ago
Reply to  Pineapple12

College Basketball is my second favorite sport and UCLA is back. March Madness is just around the corner too.

RexFregosi
Super Member
1 month ago

LA Kings hockey is my winter life line.

Twebur
Legend
1 month ago
Reply to  RexFregosi

LA Kings hockey is my winter life line

May and June is the way this year…. Keep your schedule open for spring and early summer.

Go Kings Playoff Hockey!

FungoAle
Legend
1 month ago
Reply to  RexFregosi

Fauck…love Kings hockey but the Byfield vs Stutzle decision is not aging well

red floyd
Legend
1 month ago
Reply to  FungoAle

Byfield is an idiot.

HalosFanForLife
Super Member
1 month ago

I don’t know if anyone saw Michael Nelson posting his video – but he looks to be in great shape. Might have taken off a few pounds.

halofansince1978
Super Member
1 month ago

Please post the link to that video.

halofansince1978
Super Member
1 month ago

STUD MUFFIN!!! Is that his personal gym?

HalosFanForLife
Super Member
1 month ago

I’m almost pretty sure that’s his Jersey home where his home gym and overlooks a full court indoor basketball court.

Pineapple12
Super Member
1 month ago

Mike should consider swapping the 500 lbs of weights for some agility and flexibility training. Anyhow, he looks great!

halofansince1978
Super Member
1 month ago
Reply to  Pineapple12

Pretty sure Mike does it all and a professional trainer telling him to do it all is likely off camera.

Pineapple12
Super Member
1 month ago

I’m sure. Just being cheeky that the guy who gets chronically injured might benefit from less body builder type lifting.

Angelz4ever
Super Member
1 month ago
Reply to  Pineapple12

Noone gets to see Trout in his ballet tights though.

halofansince1978
Super Member
1 month ago
Reply to  Angelz4ever

Made Me Laugh!!

Marcotor
Trusted Member
1 month ago

But is it the “Best shape of his life”?

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