LA Angels Monday News Crash- Rear View Mirror

Well 2020 is now in the rear view mirror. What positive developments might we expect in 2021?

Angels Related Links

OK.  Today Joel Reuter has the Angels as one of six contending teams that have work to do on their pitching staff.  He believes it is imperative that the Angels go all in to sign Trevor Bauer.  Does Bauer merit a five year commitment at $175 Million?  FanDuel, on the other hand, has us in the bottom half of teams ranked by World Series odds.  Maybe we are contending for something else.  Our offense is something to be hopeful about, at least. Since it is the New Year, we are presented with a bevy of “Top Ten’ and “Ten Worst” style articles today.  Concerning Jo Adell, I think the Angels found out what they wanted to know.  He needs time in the minors.  Hopefully there will be minor leagues this year.  Let’s hope his struggles end up in the rear view mirror.

The Top 100 Angels continues this week with Chuck Finley. Last week, as you may recall, was Jim Fregosi week.

Links From Around Baseball

The word is, MLB players are going to have to wait in line like everybody else for their coronavirus vaccinations. Socrates Brito, who has already survived COVID-19, signs a minor league deal with the Yankees and has a Spring Training invite.   Tomoyuki Sugano turns into a pumpkin in three days.  He’s here in the United States.  Who will be the team that can sign him?  Masahiro Tanaka implied over the weekend that he hasn’t yet received a contract offer from a Major League team.  He is even contemplating going back to Japan. First baseman Eric Thames is definitely going back to Asia, having signed with the Yomiuri Giants. 

The Cubs traded Yu Darvish and Victor Caratini to the Padres, much to the surprise of Yu Darvish.  Teams are starting to show interest in closer Alex Colome.  The Angels already have Raisel Iglesias, which probably explains why they are not mentioned in this article.  The Marlins signed left-handed pitcher Ross Detweiler to a Major League contract.  I trust that Perry is going after bigger game. Hansel Robles’ deal with the Twins is for one year at $2 Million.  Do they get 2019 Robles or 2020 Robles?  Only time will tell.  It’s kind of silly that the article refers to him as “Former Mets reliever” while showing him in an Angels uniform. The article originated at SNY.tv.

Photo credit: Rex Fregosi

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2002heaven
Super Member
3 years ago

Or we koodah had Christian Vasquez in the 9th rd in the 2008 MLB draft!!
But thar woodah required competent scouting and player development…….oh sh*t many of yoo think Bawstin’s farm system sucks after Dombrowski plundered it!!!!!
dammit silly me!!!

Commander_Nate
Member
Trusted Member
3 years ago

The Casali deal with San Francisco confirms what I’ve long suspected since a few minutes ago: All money is going to pitching. Sugano and Bauer will both be Angels by Thursday night*. You heard it here first.

*This is based on absolutely nothing.

Cowboy26
Legend
3 years ago
Reply to  Commander_Nate

So who the hell are all of our wondrous pitchers going to the throw the ball to?

steelgolf
Super Member
3 years ago
Reply to  Cowboy26

“Taylor Ward, do you still have your catching gear?”

WallyChuckChili
Legend
3 years ago
Reply to  steelgolf

Jose Molina
Player/Coach

Senator_John_Blutarsky
Legend

Soth is available. Just sayin’

eyespy
Super Member
3 years ago

If this was the NHL, I would so, Yes We Can

JackFrost
Super Member
3 years ago
Reply to  Commander_Nate

Thanks for that really encouraging comment!

gitchogritchoffmypettis
Legend
Reply to  Commander_Nate

Sure, why not? You’re about as informed as anyone else, you’re just honest about it.

Eric_in_Portland
Legend
3 years ago
Reply to  Commander_Nate

don’t know if it’ll be those two (in fact I doubt it) but I, too, get the feeling that this is the week something happens.

Jeff Joiner
Editor
Legend
3 years ago

Every year I get fixated on one under the radar signing I really want. This year it was Curt Casali.

For $1.5 million to add immediate, quality catching depth this seems like a big missed opportunity to me.

Guest
3 years ago
Reply to  Jeff Joiner

Someone here who shall remain nameless posited that McCann’s signing would drive up Casali’s price. Not so, gitcho.

How’s Maddon’s relationship with Willson Contreras?

gitchogritchoffmypettis
Legend
Reply to 

Uhhhh, that was someone responding to me saying that the alternatives were all going to get more expensive. So…. gitcho not so? Still, I expected him to get at least 2M a year…. or more than 1 year. I still seriously doubt the Caselli/Suzuki type market’s suddenly going to get expensive just cause McCann got paid.

Guest
3 years ago

I don’t take any of this stuff seriously, but this is what I referred to, in response to my question as to why we didn’t sign Casali awhile back (yeah I know – I should get a life…)

Why do you think Caseli wants to sign right now? He’s probably got some good options that may open up in the non-Realmuto/McCann markets. I mean think about it, most GMs are going to him before Yadi Molina. I doubt he’s just jumping at the first solid offers he gets and he may even wait until after McCann signs then try to get a 2 year deal at 1/2 the money, etc. It’s not as though we’ve figured out his value but his agent hasn’t.

gitchogritchoffmypettis
Legend
Reply to 

Yah. He didn’t jump…. and also didn’t get offered much apparently. I mean, that contract is LOW. I’m just guessing here, but he MUST have had some stipulations he was stuck on, like wanting an NL team or a certainty he will start some or something cause I just can’t imagine there was NO other team offering more than 1.5 if his agent called around. But hey, maybe not. This offseason is mighty tight.

gitchogritchoffmypettis
Legend
Reply to  Jeff Joiner

I know. I’m bummed. If I was the type of grown man to use emojis I’d plop a sad face down right here. I seriously doubt the problem was that PArte wouldn’t go to 2 Mill. Maybe he just likes the NL? I wish we’d got heem though.

Jeff Joiner
Editor
Legend
3 years ago

I’m really surprised at the contract, too. He’d been out there for a while and him and his agent obviously thought this was the best offer he’d get, though.

FungoAle
Legend
3 years ago
Reply to  Jeff Joiner

I liked Casali but this news surely does not sink my off-season. He was from Walnut Creek and had connections on the roster. But foolishly, I thought he would be a Caratini-type of acquisition utilized to entice some Reds pitchers to come our way.

gitchogritchoffmypettis
Legend
Reply to  FungoAle

Ahhhhh… from Contra Costa and has old teammates on the Giants. Maybe he wanted a Bay Area team? Still, man that’s very little money to pay a fairly good catcher with a year of control left. I’m butt hurt he didn’t want to come to the Heim.

WallyChuckChili
Legend
3 years ago

Cheap Arte

FungoAle
Legend
3 years ago

A guy we liked, Curt Casali…SF Giants, $1.5M/year. Reported by Bob Nightengale.

Last edited 3 years ago by FungoAle
2002heaven
Super Member
3 years ago
Reply to  FungoAle

comment image
heee wee goh again with the catching prawblem……..gawly jeepers
herde mor abawt it than the pitching and the fahrm sistem’s sorry performance.

admkir
Trusted Member
3 years ago

This just my observation but I am watching everyone drool over Bauer, Gray and Castillo. But looking a little deeper I see all 3 pitching in the Central where last season it was considered the least competitive of the 3 divisions. Because of the pandemic they were not required to pitch against the Yanks, Dodgers, Rays, Padres, Braves or any of the better teams. So are they really as good as their records indicate?

Jeff Joiner
Editor
Legend
3 years ago
Reply to  admkir

Good point. Numbers were definitely impacted by competition level. Look at the way Maeda had an incredible year in the Central, too.

losangel
Trusted Member
3 years ago
Reply to  Jeff Joiner

Agreed! Great point. Could also be why the Cubs were willing to sell high on Darvish (besides for the fact they are cheap)

2002heaven
Super Member
3 years ago
Reply to  admkir

And meanwhile the AL West had one team with a winning record in 2020? 🤔 

Jeff Joiner
Editor
Legend
3 years ago

It is pretty crazy how similar Bauer and Gray are if you look at career numbers.

Gray: 117 ERA+, 1.220 WHIP, 7.8 H/9, 0.9 HR/9, 3.2 BB/9, 8.5 K/9, 2.65 SO/W

Bauer: 113 ERA+, 1.265 WHIP, 7.9 H/9, 1.1 HR/9, 3.4 BB/9, 9.7 K/9, 2.82 SO/W

Bauer is coming off a tremendous 60 inning stretch, almost certainly using the same pine tar technique he’s long accused the Astros of using, but over the course of their careers there’s really no difference.

matthiasstephan
Super Member
3 years ago
Reply to  Jeff Joiner

And since 2020 was such an outlier for Bauer (which he notes himself) it seems like a tough call to stake 100+M on that continuing (especially if it requires a ‘new’ technique and moral stance from the pitcher).

Jeff Joiner
Editor
Legend
3 years ago

Bauer is two years and two months younger than Tanaka and has more upside, but compare Tanaka’s career numbers to date:

114 ERA+, 1.130 WHIP, 8.4 H/9, 1.4 HR/9, 1.8 BB/9, 8.5 SO/9, 5.50 SO/W.

Tanaka’s estimated to get 3/39 or so. The leap to $200 million from there seem unfathomable to me. A GM has to really believe he’s going to get several years of 2020 production.

gitchogritchoffmypettis
Legend
Reply to  Jeff Joiner

Or he has to be superextraduperserious about appearing to care about fielding a champion so that the Yankees fans, I mean Angels fans, don’t erupt with righteous fury.

GrandpaBaseball
Legend
3 years ago

I see that we are in about the middle of the pack for odds of being the World Series winner in 2021. PMGM might now get a move on since it is now 2021 and improve our odds.

DMAGZ13
Trusted Member
3 years ago

I know that social media is not real life, but I’m sorta getting annoyed with Jo Adell. He’s talking about seats filled, and the crowd jumping… like dude you were the worst player in baseball last year. Work on your game. He has been way too deflective of being horrible. I want to see Mamba Mentality.

eyespy
Super Member
3 years ago
Reply to  DMAGZ13

He’s not a cloud, he’s like twenty

FungoAle
Legend
3 years ago
Reply to  DMAGZ13

Trade him or make sure he starts the year in AA or AAA. Maybe this would light the fuse.

gitchogritchoffmypettis
Legend
Reply to  FungoAle

Didn’t Maddon already say he’s starting in AAA…. or did I dream that? Either way, he is almost certain to start in AAA and I doubt they really wanted him up here getting his ass handed to him last year. Sure, a bunch of the experts here online were talking like he was ready a year ago, but no one from the Angels was.

FungoAle
Legend
3 years ago

Maddon thinks he needs more minor league reps. Being the manager, I think his vote counts so yes, probably can construe that Jo will be the starting RF for the Bees. He can play pepper with Graterol.

I think it was more, let’s throw him out there and see what he’s got as we are not making the playoffs, again. Some prospects can leap to the show after only spending a short time in AAA. As there was no organized minor-league baseball in COVID-2020, seemed like a worthwhile thing to do. The major complaint, Angels should not have keeping him in the line-up even though he clearly was overmatched in the environment, on and off the field.

JackFrost
Super Member
3 years ago
Reply to  DMAGZ13

I follow him on IG as well. I hear what you are saying and somewhat agree. I think a lot of young players go through a phase like this.

In his defense a little bit he does seem to put a good amount of time into working out and conditioning etc..What I would say is that maybe he is not spending his time on the things he could be or should be working on.

So instead of putting as much time in the cage, he could be working more on improving his tracking of fly balls in the outfield etc, which I know he worked with Joe on in season. But that was his biggest weakness so it makes sense to focus on it.

Last edited 3 years ago by JackFrost
eatgrasslikegoat
Member
3 years ago
Reply to  JackFrost

i think you guys should tell him

gitchogritchoffmypettis
Legend

” HARR DARR DUH HELL JOE ADELL! YAR BAR THE BALL FLY FARRR!!! I KNOW IT’S BEEN CHRISTMAR AND GNAR YAR BUT I ARE OLD AN SAR SO MANY BASEBAR FOR YARS AND YARS! GOO GOO GAH TELL YOOO WHATCHA DO! SAMBA BLACK MAMBA OR YOU 1987 HONDA! GRIT PUMP YAR RUMP OR A DOODLE CHUMP LUMP POINT DAR FINGAR LIKE A STUMP! WAR CLEATS TO BED! NO STUFFIN HAMBURGER HEAD!”

JackFrost
Super Member
3 years ago

I’m sure that would go really well,lol.

gitchogritchoffmypettis
Legend
Reply to  DMAGZ13

If Adell promises to go shag some fly balls will you promise to never drop “Mamba Mentality” again. Hell, why not Mamba yourself a little and not even notice what some baseball kid is talking about on social media in the dead of winter and focus on what ever it is that makes you so friggin Mamba?

eatgrasslikegoat
Member
3 years ago

thank you lmfao <3

Senator_John_Blutarsky
Legend

Please gawd let it not be us that are silently hunting Tomoyuki Sugano. We have too many #4 / #5 starting pitchers already…..

Guest
3 years ago

Just because you said it.

matthiasstephan
Super Member
3 years ago

I wouldn’t mind Sugano, as long as that isn’t the only SP we bring in. If we can sign Sugano and trade for someone else (Musgrove, Kyle Hendricks, Castillo, Marquez), that wouldn’t be the worst outcome.

I don’t think we have the prospect capital to trade for two starters, and I don’t think we the money to pay two decent FA starters, but one of each should be possible.

Jeff Joiner
Editor
Legend
3 years ago

Exactly. We need one of each and likely only have the ability to get one headliner.

Sugano, Happ, Odorizzi, all of the names in the second tier have some appeal and some downside. That’s why they are the second tier.

FungoAle
Legend
3 years ago
Reply to  Jeff Joiner

A 1-yr of Happ might work plus a trade.for Gray or Castillo or Musgrove. There are still many arms out on the FA market that certainly could help us. As time goes by, do we think this could drop the trade value? Teams could elect just to sign an arm.

Last edited 3 years ago by FungoAle
Jeff Joiner
Editor
Legend
3 years ago
Reply to  FungoAle

GM’s apparently think waiting out the second tier will get guys to drop their prices.

As far as trades, I doubt it. Unless a team absolutely just wants to dump payroll, there’s no rush.

Eric_in_Portland
Legend
3 years ago
Reply to  Jeff Joiner

but economics should tell us that when the supply decreases and the demand is still there prices don’t drop but can actually rise. If I have $33mil to spend and my top choices are gone I’m more likely to find Cahills and Harveys to splurge on.

Jeff Joiner
Editor
Legend
3 years ago

In general, yes, but this year there appears to be a pretty large supply of second tier pitchers and an even larger supply of bullpen pieces but not a clear amount of demand.

Guys get nervous as the calendar gets closer to reporting day.

FungoAle
Legend
3 years ago
Reply to  Jeff Joiner

I’m sure you’re right here. I’m not even really sure how desperate Pirates and Reds are to trade those guys. They are cost controlled so they could roll with them in 2021. I can see the Yanks jumping in on Castillo and now the Dodgers are in the Castillo hunt.

There is just a large number of arms out there on the FA market. Guys like Chatwood, Richards, Wood and Folty are arms I would take a chance on and these are 3-4th tier arms. Angels can not afford to roll the dice on these guys unless we obtained proven arms in addition but I would not mind one of these guys stashed on our roster. There are going to be some bargains. Hoping we could package up Barria/Pena and maybe even Canning with something to get a No. 1. We could always backfill their roster spot with the FA plethora.

matthiasstephan
Super Member
3 years ago
Reply to  Jeff Joiner

Am I wrong in thinking the main downside on Sugano is based on the potential he can’t transition well to MLB? His stats in Japan are better than Ohtani’s (though he was slightly older in each relative year than Ohtani was) and Ohtani (injury aside) could certainly compete pitching.

Happ is a 37, so the hope is he can keep pitching at that level, and Odorizzi is coming off a tough 2020 campaign (but was good before) so one is hoping for a comeback.

Sugano, however, has been consistently good and is ‘only’ 30. He is a bit younger than Tanaka, and I think Tanaka is a good comp for the transition (moves from high 1 ERA to mid 3 ERA – which would be better than most anyone we have in the rotation now. Even with that level of drop off in stats, he is still better than Odorizzi and Happ (though Happ is a lefty).

gitchogritchoffmypettis
Legend

Yah, I’m not gonna scorn Segano if they sign him. I see a couple hundred 4.00 ERA innings out of the guy…. we can totally use that. But I’m also a guy who doesn’t get upset when one of his Christmas presents is socks and underwear, so what do I know?

Jeff Joiner
Editor
Legend
3 years ago

I tend to think the same.

GrandpaBaseball
Legend
3 years ago

Marquez is still out there along with Castillo and Gray and they all would look good in red.

eatgrasslikegoat
Member
3 years ago

Sonny would look good in my mouth

GrandpaBaseball
Legend
3 years ago

What?

Guest
3 years ago

Goats eat anything.

Eric_in_Portland
Legend
3 years ago

I don’t wanna know

eatgrasslikegoat
Member
3 years ago

i thought it was clear enough  😕 

gitchogritchoffmypettis
Legend

Lonely Covid winter……

Jeff Joiner
Editor
Legend
3 years ago

I think Gray is the realistic target out of those three.

Guest
3 years ago
Reply to  Jeff Joiner

I hope you’re right. Maybe you should send PM your simulators, or Maguire’s.

Jeff Joiner
Editor
Legend
3 years ago
Reply to 

I’ll send him a text, ha ha.

He’s more expensive than Castillo and not quite as good as Marquez. Thing is the Central is such crap right now that Castillo/Gray is the best 1-2 in it and with even modest rebounds from guys like Moose and Castellanos the Reds could win it.

Guest
3 years ago
Reply to  Jeff Joiner

I hope I’m wrong but I can’t see any team trading their young, cheap, good pitching. Hoping for Castillo or Marquez doesn’t seem realistic, especially with our farm, but since Musgrove, maybe.

JackFrost
Super Member
3 years ago
Reply to 

If they are a team that cannot afford to pay those players (when they are no longer cost controlled) then sure, it can happen.

When teams wait it out they lose some leverage and if the player is going into FA they of course get much less back in return. The present goals of the selling team and the timing of it are everything.

GrandpaBaseball
Legend
3 years ago

Bauer, you know, the guy that just wants a one year deal, has left the building. Now believes he is worth 175 million for 5 years. I want Bauer very badly but he is not at all worth 35 million dollars per season. Let the Mets have him. Hello, Pittsburgh…..

AnAngelsFan
Super Member
3 years ago

Of course he says he’s worth that. That’s how the system works. Cole was the best free agent pitcher and got $35 million. Bauer is the best FA pitcher this year and uses that as a benchmark. The teams argue he isn’t as good as Cole.

Those numbers frame the starting points for negotiations, but actual demand sets the final price.

eyespy
Super Member
3 years ago

Wow, he is discounting. Dropped 3 years and 5M from what I seen last.

Guest
3 years ago
Reply to  eyespy

Sell! Sell!

red floyd
Legend
3 years ago
Reply to 

comment image

FungoAle
Legend
3 years ago

The scuttlebutt is that he has no offers at $30M per season and nobody plans to give him that. He is closer to a Wheeler price than Gerrit Cole. I think his antics has taken the shine off of him plus inconsistent years. Maybe will get $25M AAV for 5-years?? But…who really knows. Perry has a plan and I think it will also involve the offense.

Guest
3 years ago
Reply to  FungoAle

He wants to be a Wheeler dealer but we should scuttle his butt.

matthiasstephan
Super Member
3 years ago
Reply to  FungoAle

Unless Bauer is happy with a backloaded deal (say 15M this year, and more in the final years), I don’t see us paying 125M/5 Years for Bauer (though he is likely worth that). It would take up most if not all of our realistic budget, and we need that other starter (that even on a trade costs 10-15M).

JackFrost
Super Member
3 years ago

I do not think that number is all that unreasonable. Based upon what Cole got he is in the ballpark.

Of course in negotiating you always ask for MORE than what you think you are worth or, will potentially get, so you can come down a little and still be happy with the number.

In any case, this is basic economics. If teams all balk at his demand he and his agent will be forced to come down a little. But I think the Mets or Dodgers will give him something close to what he’s asking, and unless it is for more than three years I don’t think 33-34 mil AAV is unfair for him.

I hope we can still land him, but I fear Arte might have already made his best pitch. Hope not.

Cowboy26
Legend
3 years ago
Reply to  JackFrost

Take it our leave it Adrian. We need an answer right now.