The position players have reported. Soon there will be games. Here is Shohei Ohtani pitching at Angels camp before heading off to join Team Japan. Max Stassi is working on his swing to try to get it back the way it was in 2020 and 2021. Meanwhile Andrew Velazquez has decided to remain a switch hitter. Taylor Ward has high expectations for himself and says “The goal this year is definitely to avoid the wall.”
The White Sox designated Bennett Sousa for assignment to make room for Elvis Andrus. It appears that Elvis will get $3 Million for one year.
MLB formed an Economic Reform Committee as a reaction to all the money Steve Cohen is spending and the impending bankruptcy of Diamond Sports Group. This article goes through the rosters of the various teams in the World Baseball Classic. Did you know Tony Reagins is the General Manager of Team USA?
Anderson Comas, a minor league pitcher in the White Sox system, became the second player in affiliated baseball to come out publicly as gay while still active.
Photo credit: Rex Fregosi
The Latte Sippers over at LL take a look at the AL West pitching
https://www.lookoutlanding.com/2023/2/21/23608779/american-league-west-preview-2023-starting-rotations-astros-angels-athletis-rangers
I’m hoping for some sweet sweet young pitcher regression from the Ms.
A) pitching holds up, hitting is great, we’re in strong contention at the trade deadline. We keep Ohtani. Hope Trout convinces him to take a home town discount!
B) we lose two starters, and the backups remind us of last year’s general replacements. We’re obviously out of it, trade Ohtani at or near the deadline. Presuming he’s kicking butt, we get a nice haul. Preferably at least two players that will be ready for 2024. Say May and Pages? Maybe another prospect?
C) we’re on the edge. Probably will make the wild card, but maybe not. Tough choice.
I don’t think we should trade now, since A) is a realistic possibility, and not sure the haul would be that much better now than at the deadline. And trading now would have to be demoralizing for the team. Bad for attendance too. 30%?
Unfortunately C) seems most likely, but I’m hoping for A)!
The haul now will pretty much 100% be more than at the deadline. Why would they ever be nearly the same for 4 months less guaranteed Ohtani?
Gotta remember, that other team’s GM isn’t some feelzy fan boy. Demand for him now is probably pretty high, won’t be all that much higher in August.
I Vote:
(D) Pitching holds up, hitting is great, we’re in strong contention at the trade deadline So we trade for Corbin Burnes and Tim Anderson at the trade deadline we kick ass in the playoffs and Ohtani begs us to re-sign him.
HUZZAH! The only thing you forgot is Tucky D Davidson for Cy Young baby!
Del Taco for the enter US team!!!
And that’s a MACHO home run for Mike Trout, brought to you by Del Taco!
enterentire, dammit. Stupid autocorrect.Didn’t see this one posted yet – apologies if it has been:
https://sports.yahoo.com/shohei-ohtanis-agent-angels-star-has-earned-the-right-to-explore-free-agency-055417844.html
And we have earned the right to trade him.
No no lets let him walk for free!
Why would we do that when we can get a most revered second round draft pick?
They do pretty much make or break a franchise.
I think most real baseball people will understand that, while we could have gotten a huge pile of advanced prospects for Ohtani last summer, it’s way more coolest and also committed to championish to let it ride and then hope you can overpay a guy for a decade…. or, even better, get that 2nd round pick that orgs just can’t survive without.
That’s how real baseball manz does it!
The other part of the cup half full position of letting it ride is that in addition to the prized 2nd round pick, we’ll have an additional $500,000,000 to play around with.
We’d also have all that cash plus some prospects plus 30M if we trade him today.
We missed that boat…. if we had traded him earlier in the offseason, we would have what you said… and the cash could have been used to sign someone like Rodon or whoever. Now there is little we would do with the cash (until next offseason).
Only use would be trading for an expensive player a team can’t pay anymore.
True, we could take on a big salary dump in order to acquire talent.
and it also means you’re just punting away 2023 because we wouldn’t be getting back a CyYoung Candidate and middle of the order DH.
miketrout doesn’t cares about cash and prospects
The team has punted away lots of previous seasons. At least this way there would be hope for the future.
I am willing to delay gratification.
When it’s 4th and 9 punting is smart. And Trout can dry his tears with a massive pile of money. He’d also probably prefer to be good by 2030. Extending Ohtani makes us exactly the team we have now, just in an even tighter payroll vice. The. Same. Team. An upgrade from a trade isn’t a sure thing, but the same team the day before as the day after an extension is a sure thing. Also certain, when he leaves, we will be the same team… but with a second round draft pick.
If Trouts the golden god we think he is he gets that.
But we’d lose this season of enjoying him play for us.
I’d rather delay the gratification and build a long lasting team. I get no joy in watching the team suck with two great individual players.
Yes. And that is a bummer. But it’s still the smart move.
Plus, we’d be out on Wilson. Do you think Shohei would take 4/58?
What about Granderson?
Is he available?
The stupidity of the failure to trade Ohtani is astonishing to me under the circumstances. Odds are it will be the subject of a lot of regret based discussions on this site when he leaves as a free agent and the Angels get only a second round pick.
The ONLY way not trading him works is if (1) they go deep in the playoffs and (2) Ohtani signs an extension to stay an Angel. I’d evaluate the chances of that at 15% at best. But of course fanatics going into Spring Training think magically (Unicorns!) and pay no attention to reality.
85% odds are that the Angels finish around .500 and miss the playoffs and Ohtani is gone. If I’m a sane person, an unemotional person or even someone who likes to gamble but is aware of the odds, I’m trading him right now (and would have traded him last year).
I’d put the probability at 500,000,000%
I just don’t get how anybody hears “he’ll want 500M” and doesn’t just say “nope. that’s not for us. not right now. sorry.”
I don’t care that he’s super good. No single player is worth all that and none of the teams that I want to emulate sign contracts like that one….. much less three of them.
The reasons not to trade him are all fanaticism driven emotional drivel. Like saying “you don’t trade Babe Ruth’. Well if this were that timeframe and players were controlled by ownership and salaries artificially low – then yes – keep him. But there is no way this team should pay him $500m-plus even if he would stay. It would sink this Organization farther than it already is. But magic, unicorns etc.
Cardinals would have traded him at last year’s trade deadline if they were in the same sad position as this franchise.
I mean…a team trying to win right now has defensible reasons to want to retain the most valuable player/asset in baseball.
Whether or not that is wise is a matter of opinion given the condition of the farm. But acting like there is *no* reason to want Ohtani here feels like the pendulum swinging too far the other way. That is silly.
IMO trading him made sense in July. Arte selling the team before the cable TV revenue bursts also made sense to me though and he didn’t do that either.
A real question worth considering: how much do you trust the Angels to get the right return? The Marlins traded Miguel Cabrera for cant miss prospects Cameron Maybin and Andrew Miller. Didn’t exactly transform their fortunes because bad teams make bad trades too.
Good question, but a separate one for me.
I’d rather trade and receive a return that has a shot at really improving the team (but as you said, maybe it doesn’t), instead of not trading, and guaranteeing that we get no return.
It’s just insane for this team to take on a 10 year/$500 m contract for one player based on the contracts that are already on the books. It would impact every aspect of this team not to mention available monies for future free agents and players such as Sandoval who will need to be paid. You can get or keep 3 or 4 good players for $50 million.
And it is unlikely Ohtani will want to stay anyway.
Under these circumstances I believe it is idiotic of this organization not to have traded him already and/or looking to trade him now.
It’s hard for me to stomach all the bitching about Wells and Hambone and Pujols and Rendon and then see the same people begging the team to give what will be a 30 year old pitcher the largest contract evah.
Exactly! Those who don’t learn from the past are doomed to repeat it.
Thanks for the words of wisdom Rev Jones
You’re welcome. This sorry franchise never learns from its considerable mistakes.
As I said above. Ohtani is very good. I like him. There is value in that. There is also risk in trading for prospects. This is true.
But if we extend him all we have is
The
Same
Team
As We Do
Today
Ohtani doesn’t magically become twice the Ohtani after we pay him. Same value then as now…. only aging.
Plus more payroll bloat.
So the choice is more of the same, with more problems with salary and age. Or we take a risk.
If this team’s/org’s as hopeless as so many people love to say it is I don’t see how this is that hard a decision.
Need more top MLB 100 prospects that will be kicking ass in the California League.
Arte is not going down as the owner who traded Ohtani. Never was in cards. Had to tell his GM to pull him off the market. He’ll make an effort to resign him and when Ohtani walks, he can say, “see, I tried.” Guilt-free.
And this is exactly why this franchise will never be the Cardinals.
So then why didn’t the Cards trade Pujols when they had the opportunities? They had no intention to re-sign him yet ran the season out with him only to let him walk in free agency for a measly comp pick.
Cards won the WS in 2010, won 90 games in 2011 and were in contention all 2012. That’s a different situation.
If the Angels had shown any potential or real improvement to where they could realistically compete for a WS championship, I would not be so strong on the trade Ohtani thing.
But other than unicorn thinking- realistically this club is most likely to finish around .500. So it’s a different situation. If the Cards had been in that situation in 2011, i have no doubt they would have traded Pujols.
So what you’re saying is if the Angels are in contention this year, there is no way they should trade Ohtani during the season.
Got it.
I’m saying that I give the Angels a 10%-15% chance of making the playoffs this season based on the last 5. With those low odds, I would be looking to the future rather than the present and make sure I got as much as possible for the team’s biggest trade chip. That is what I would do because I am a realist and don’t count on long shots to come in.
If by some stroke of magic luck, the team plays way WAY above my expectations and is say 20 games over .500 at the trade deadline, then you’re right – I would not trade him but instead make a run. That is because in that situation the unlikely would have happened and that changes the analysis.
But as the team stands today, and particularly where it was at the last trade deadline, I think it is idiotic not to trade Ohtani and look to the future.
I do think Fans right in that, if the Angels were already a team that won a WS a couple years ago and made deep play off runs since I’d be more inclined to pay Ohtani, try to win a couple more over the next few years, and then probably suffer at the end of Trout/Ohtani’s deals.
If this team was the 2005-2009 Angels, I’d sign Ohtani for sure and make a WS run. But it’s not.
Yes – agreed – there will be a piper to pay for the Trout and Rendon contracts (much less $500m for Ohtani) as they age. I’d argue that the Rendon contract is already an albatross.
I’d pay Ohtani if there was a legitimate shot to win a Championship or two. And by legitimate that means deep playoff runs in the last few years. Not just ‘well if everything breaks our way over 162 games and AA players end up being real major leaguers’ kind of legit.
We were 24-13 on May 15th. Barring injuries, even last year’s team ‘could realistically compete’.
Wait – you think Rendon getting injured caused the 0-14? I don’t see it that way. I see the fast start being similar to 2021’s and the team eventually regressing to what it is….a middle of the pack club.
Sure – everything COULD go right but it’s just not likely. But sometimes it happens. I just would not maybe decisions based on hope.
Yep. The Braves, the Cardinals, the Rays with 3 times the salary…. all those teams would have already collected on him.
Would they? I’m not so sure of that. Right now the Braves payroll is $13 million higher than ours and they’re signing all of their young acquisitions to long term contract so Ohtani would fit right in.
Accept Ohtani isn’t that young, the Braves don’t already have Trout and Rendon, their big payroll is spread out, they won a WS a year ago and are a contender now, they won’t be paying anyone into their late 30s much less 40s, they are even less risk averse with pitchers past 30, their farm is stacked…
But other than that, sure, they’re just like us.
Signing a 1B who is a year younger than Ohtani to a contract that never tops 22M and runs out when he’s 35 years old is very different than signing a 29 year old pitcher/DH to a ten year deal at 50M AAV.
The 2025 Braves will pay Austin Riley, Matt Olson, Sean Murphy and Ronald Acuna a combined 76M that year…. they are going about having a big payroll in the opposite way that paying Shohei will work.
Apparently, because he’s the Asian Jesus of Baseball, we’re supposed to do the right champiham thing and let him play out the season and then hope for the best.
Because that’s what all the really good organizations do. Eek out one more season of fun and then do your best to fill the gaping hole…. and fk prospects, donkey fan has already declared we can’t develop them and those guys aren’t famous so no commitment points either.
Sure, Ohtani may sign here I guess, but I’m sure everyone on here who has advocated for keeping him this year will totally own it when Ohtani signs someplace else (as they have all been saying he would). They are all real baseball people after all. They understand that this is a total gamble. There’s just no way they could possibly be a bunch of morons who are counting on our getting to the World Series this year and THEN “showing commitment to championshit” by throwing more money at Shohei than any other team no matter what. In the very likely chance neither of those things happen they’ll just shrug their shoulders and accept that that’s the cookie they wanted to let crumble. There’s just no way that hope is involved, because hope is not a plan and they won’t be fooled. I know this because they have told it to me over and over again.
This looks like pretty major hope as a plan. Real baseball people must just know stuff I don’t.
The longer this goes, the lower the return will be. We’ve already missed the window to get maximum return. Don’t take the risk of only getting a 2nd round draft choice. PTP should make a front loaded offer that plays out to $45m AAV. If he declines, trade him.
Agree. I think they should trade him before opening day if he won’t sign an extension. That would be really unpopular and awkward though, so it won’t happen.
Well, you have to ask yourself, is it going to be more unpopular than keeping him till August, being at .500, trading him for a couple meh prospects, or better yet holding onto him, losing in the wild card round, and watching him sign elsewhere? That big fat nothing we get for him is gonna feel awkward.
More awkward than trading him now, showing that your org understands practicality, and getting something to build on in the process?
I have no sources whatsoever, but my hunch is Nez didn’t just go to camp yesterday to “check it out.” Aside from talking to Perry, he probably had a meeting with Arte to discuss a potential extension.
This reminds me of when the media was doing everything they could to push out the story that trout was going to be a free agent and leave the Angels. Both sides said nothing more than lip service. Then the last week of spring training when the team was heading back to Anaheim the news broke out that trout was signing a lifetime extension. If Shohei wants to stay with the Angels, then an extension will get done before the season starts imo.
Yah, I’m sure there was some kind of interaction…. though some of it may have also been related to Shohei flying off to Japan for ST.
The maximum return we can get is if he goes lights out again for us hitting and pitching and leads us to the AL Pennant.
Missing Persons says nobody walks in LA.
Unless they get four balls.
So Dale really was a Dale?
Who knew?
What do you do with an elephant with three balls?
Walk him and pitch to the rhino.
we’re gonna have to win the World Series this year
Sorry but you have now left me no choice :
https://memes.getyarn.io/yarn-clip/5a741c10-6332-4a16-b1c9-13aa562ca36d
But Does this F Bomb count against my 2023 quota or Tom Berenger’s?
Trade him. If we wait till August we are going to literally get three of a teams mid-teens prospects back. We should not be the team paying this guy anyway. Do we want to be the 2021 Braves or the 2012 Yankees?
I don’t care about feelz. If the Doyers would do a preseason overpay in order to acquire and extend Ohtani and send us some mix of Andy Pages/Dustin May/Gavin Stone/Ryan Pepiot/Bobby Miller/James Outman/Eddys Leonard we should take it.
We all know Arturo would never allow a trade for Ohtani, unless it’s at the deadline and the team has imploded yet again. It shouldn’t have came to anyone’s surprise that Arturo shot down the idea of trading Ohtani last summer, which would have been the smart thing to do from an organizational standpoint.
Arte is going to do whatever it takes to extend Ohtani or keep him in free agency. He loves marketable stars, and there is no star more marketable nationally and internationally than Ohtani.
Ohtani could do Angels fans a huge solid mid-season by telling the Angels hes going to move on in free agency if things have imploded.
The return would be half of what we could have gotten last July but getting Shohei in house for a few months and getting a leg up on an extension would be very attractive to teams wanting to keep him long term like the Dodgers, Padres and Mets. There will still be a bidding war for sure in July.
If Ohtani is put on the market at the deadline then yes there will be a bidding war between competing teams, but they won’t overpay for Sho since he will just be a rental. Whereas last year’s deadline anyone could have traded for Ohtani and would have massively overpaid in top prospects given the year and a half control. Now? Not so much. Arte once again already screwed that poach. But it shouldn’t have surprised anyone. There is no chance in hell Arte would have allowed a trade for Ohtani. He’s gonna try to keep Ohtani at all costs. He’s a gold mine for the Arturo.
I wonder what exactly hes going to instruct them. https://twitter.com/RhettBollinger/status/1628066864252461056
He knows his stuff when it comes to hitting
Maybe he can help Stassi and Velasquez
He does.
More than once he helped Trout make a slight adjustment to his swing that provided dividends on the field.
Criminals and arsonists like to return to the scene of their crimes where they robbed, burned shit and conned people.
With the ban on the shift it will probably take a lot more finesse to ground into double plays this year.
You are already in playing shape with this awesome comment. There is much Gramps must do to teach the young ones.
That’s really really very bad news for our bad pitching staff which I saw right through all the overrated AL rankings (the 2022 AL batting champion was Minnesota’s Luis Arraez at just .316) Wade Boggs, Ted Williams, and Tony Gwynn could’ve done that with a BAC of .20 stumbling and falling outta bed. So yes, bad worse hitting league wide since the 2020 pandemic season doesn’t mean our pitching got better, but rather hitting got worse. I NOTICED THAT AND NOBODY ELSE DID……. 💪
Outside of #27and #17, there’s nothing else he can do to help.
BTW what catcher do the Angels have their eye on to draft #1 to play 1B. 3B, SS, OF, concessions, and lead groundskeeper for the 2023 MLB Draft? The TB Rays have made it work (winning with a cheap nameless and faceless team sans their SS position), but we ain’t them!
Youwana body massage?
I’m glad he’s back in this capacity. Enjoyed his final chapter happening elsewhere. Nice guy, really bad contract.
I saw a old, fat Dominican guy there today and I said said to myself, “damn that looks like Albert”
sho’nuff
Fox Bet has us at 15th out of 30 teams odds to win W/S.
That’s the top half of the pile…we can do it!! Halo Power
Always good to start off as an underdog. We were supposed to do well last year…..hmmm…….mkay.
At least this years underdog aint a 3 legged mangy looking blind one like in recent years past.
I’ll give you that it might now have 4 legs and can see. But it’s still a mangy mutt of a team that could either turn into a good dog or give you rabies.
But even with rabies everyone still loved Old Yeller
Right in the middle just how we like it.
Mr Blonde always had an ear for music.
Don’t forget to cut off the ear — in an homage to David Lynch of course..
Can I do it in an homage to Van Gogh instead?
[NERD-HUMOR]
Macs to the left of me, Windows to my right, here I am stuck in the middle with GNU
[/NERD-HUMOR]