LA Angels Tuesday News Crash: Firing Time

The regular season is over. It’s firing time. The Mets declined their option on manager Luis Rojas

The Orioles parted ways with their hitting coach, Don Long.  So long, Long. 

Angels Related Links

Shohei Ohtani was the most searched player in the world on MLB Film Room this year.  Shohei Ohtani also tied for the MLB lead in triples, placing him in some rare company.  Only two other players ever led baseball in triples while hitting over 40 homers. 

Angels’ number 27 prospect, Ryan Smith, closed out the season on a high note.

Now for the two minutes hate.  The Angels are called losers and the Astros are called winners in the same article here.  It’s hard to argue, but it still hurts.  

Umpires

We already knew Joe West was retiring, but it bears repeating. 

Get a load of this umpire.  Oooops!

Photo credit: Rex Fregosi

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2002heaven
Trusted Member
18 days ago

comment image
6th pick in the 1970 MLB Draft

Senator_John_Blutarsky
Super Member
Reply to  2002heaven

Douche extraordinaire

Eric_in_Portland
Super Member
18 days ago

Award ballots must all be in now so Shohei is probably already MVP

2002heaven
Trusted Member
18 days ago

comment imagecomment image
Why not both of them?  💪  💪  👈 

Jeff Joiner
Editor
Super Member
18 days ago
Reply to  2002heaven

Rendon is better than Kyle. We can’t just DFA Rendon and call it sunk cost.

The other Seager is a stud but will be crazy expensive. However, if the Angels also acquired solid pitching, I’d drool over a Trout/Ohtani/Rendon/Seager middle of the order. Walsh and Stassi would likely 7 and 8 in the lineup which is crazy.

Senator_John_Blutarsky
Super Member
Reply to  2002heaven

Like Jeff said – Rendon is ours for the contract term. Seager the Younger would be great to have, but if we’re going to spend crazy it has to be pitching first.

FungoAle
Super Member
18 days ago
Reply to  Twebur

I see more mediocrity in our future, from the article:

“(Luis) Rengifo played a really solid shortstop in September, which was really encouraging,” Minasian said. “I think (David) Fletcher has the ability to slide over if we wanted him to. As good as he is at second, he’s very confident he could play a high-level shortstop too.”

AnAngelsFan
Trusted Member
18 days ago
Reply to  FungoAle

Yep, those are worst-case scenario back-up plans that would be a sure sign of a tank year if they come to pass.

Every play has hot and cold streaks. The problem with Rengifo is that his hot streaks make him look like an average player. He hasn’t shown he can be anything more than replacement level as an everyday player. Any team using him as more than a backup is simply not going to contend.

Fletcher is one of the few pleasant surprises from the last few seasons But objectively, he doesn’t walk enough to be a valuable offensive player. At shortstop his defense wouldn’t be good enough to justify keeping him around.

JackFrost
Super Member
18 days ago
Reply to  AnAngelsFan

Fletcher at short-stop and Rengifo at 2b are not a “sign of a tank year.”

Fletcher is a high quality player; All-Star level in fact. Unfortunately his hitting slump the last month of the season was the result of being played into the ground and never rested. For some reason power hitters get rested but infielder are for some reason thought not to need it.

As far as Luis at second, alot of teams have their worst bat playing that position. Generally, it is not thought of as a really important position either offensively or defensively. Not like short or 3b or CF.

Would I like to have a really good player starting at 2b? Sure.

But what is much, much more important to me is that we have a high quality Major League rotation, with a Top 3 that are hightly competitive. We have Ohtani that means we need two more.

I will feel fine that among Sandoval, Suarez, Barria etc that we will have decent or good options at #4 and #5. I could even see one of those guys rising to the standar of a good #3.

We also need to add at least one really good bullpen arm, if not two.

So, 2b will not make or break us next year. The health of our stars and pitching WILL.

Eric_in_Portland
Super Member
18 days ago
Reply to  JackFrost

I basically agree with you but I’m trying to grasp how Fletch at short and Rengifo at second is better than Fletch at second and Rengifo at short.

That said, I’d be happy to save money at those positions (no Story, please) as well as playing Adell and Marsh and using cash for pitching plus an Ohtani extension.

2002heaven
Trusted Member
18 days ago

comment image
He’s a FA………. 💪  💪 

gitchogritchoffmypettis
Super Member
Reply to  2002heaven

I love Walt Weiss

Senator_John_Blutarsky
Super Member
Reply to  2002heaven

The ears are very distracting. Pass.

steelgolf
Super Member
18 days ago

 😆 

WallyChuckChili
Super Member
17 days ago

He’s got nothing on Ward

2002heaven
Trusted Member
18 days ago
Reply to  JackFrost

How good do you want us to be? 2000’s good or just 2014 good?
Two winning seasons and then we fall off the map again like we have since Dipoto left.

gitchogritchoffmypettis
Super Member
Reply to  JackFrost

I think the big take away from all these comments is that at no point did PTP say Rengifo would play 2B…. or even mention the two things in a single statement.

He’s probably mulling over spending all the money on all the pitchers and just having meh at SS. It’s an option. I might be OK if they signed Raisel, DeSclafani and Stroman plus a couple other pen arms but I had to live with Rengifo and some ST invite scrub at SS. But it’s likely just an option, not “the plan”.

FungoAle
Super Member
18 days ago
Reply to  JackFrost

Fletcher is a lock. Would not crush me if he was traded but off a down year, not the best time. Like to see a defensive vacuum at short to steady the infield.

AllenB
Trusted Member
18 days ago
Reply to  JackFrost

Why do I hear all the time about players needing rest? Players are supposed to be better conditioned now than ever before. Cal Ripken played 2,632 consecutive games. That’s the equivalent of 16 seasons. Fletch is fine. He hit a slump. Bad timing and bad slump. It happens.

gitchogritchoffmypettis
Super Member
Reply to  AllenB

Cause back in my day we played fundamental baseball on two broken legs uphill both ways in the snow with brass knuckles in our back pockets case it came time to get down.

matthiasstephan
Trusted Member
18 days ago
Reply to  AllenB

Even ‘back in the day’ Cal Ripken was an iron man far more durable than his peers.

Sure, compare current pitchers to Nolan Ryan too, and lament how they don’t have no-hitters every other week and pitch 400 innings a year.

gitchogritchoffmypettis
Super Member

I’m not a big time “back in my day” guy, but I do think it would be worth while to figure out a less theoretical reason pitchers are so weak now. Sure, all year ball since age 8, huge hitters, max effort every pitch, specialization… but how, more exactly, do you build effective 300 inning pitchers in this modern age? Cause lots of pitchers have “easy velo”, they are huge compared to past pitchers, they don’t throw all year (that’s actually going away slowly) and so on.

It would behoove some genius like Cherington in Pitt to apply a bunch of egg heads to actually sorting this mess out so they can get the most bang for their pitching buck and develop durable prospects.

I have been curious, are pitch counts higher than back in the day? Pitchers throw more balls cause they want gas, hitters wait on walks, so way more pitches get thrown over a kids first 10 years of pitching?

And why is everyone tearing lats and obliques now?

And why are Angels players prone to hurt their everything all the time?

Again, a wild ass idea, but I almost wish we could see some team just ban heavy workouts… develop a bunch of “country strong” players who don’t have visible abs but can hike ten miles with 50lbs on their back… see if they have a big stat drop off, are less/more durable, etc.

Jeff Joiner
Editor
Super Member
18 days ago
Reply to  FungoAle

All I see is positioning.

Talk up Rengifo a little before the trading season. Talk up Fletcher a bit so the shortstop agents don’t think you are desperate.

This is really a whole lot of nothing, IMO.

gitchogritchoffmypettis
Super Member
Reply to  Jeff Joiner

No. Mediocrity! Angry poops in pants!!! YARRR!

FungoAle
Super Member
18 days ago
Reply to  Jeff Joiner

I think it is Perry just being genuine, speaking from position. No posturing.

Commander_Nate
Member
Trusted Member
18 days ago
Reply to  FungoAle

I don’t give a shit about shortstops.

Delete the position.

Sign pitchers who K.

Win ballgames.

Senator_John_Blutarsky
Super Member
Reply to  Twebur

Ah Perry, tell us something we didn’t know….5 years ago.

Twebur
Super Member
18 days ago

Angels payroll 2022

2022 payroll as of today: $111,188,094
2022 projected payroll ceiling: $200,000,000
Available to spend: $88,811,906

Last edited 18 days ago by Twebur
Jim Atkins
Trusted Member
18 days ago

Yankees DFA Heaney according to MLB Trade Rumors. ERA went up to 7.32 because of 13 home runs given up in 35 2/3 innings. Think anybody will pick him up? I kind of think he’s done. .

Eric_in_Portland
Super Member
18 days ago
Reply to  Jim Atkins

reading your post sent me scurrying over to transactions. I see, for the Angels, we’ve recalled CRod. I thought he was done until later in 2022. I guess not! Should I be encouraged? Or is this a paper shuffle?

FungoAle
Super Member
18 days ago
Reply to  Jim Atkins

Somebody will pick him up and help straighten him out. NY was a tough place to land but I can see him in the NL and doing well.

Eric_in_Portland
Super Member
18 days ago
Reply to  FungoAle

SF

YOUknowulovetheIE
Trusted Member
18 days ago
Reply to  FungoAle

I don’t see him doing well anywhere. All his pitches are average and he misses over the middle way too often.

Fansince1971
Super Member
18 days ago
Reply to  Jim Atkins

Depends on the price tag

Senator_John_Blutarsky
Super Member
Reply to  Jim Atkins

He’ll get a look on a minor league deal next spring, but he’s not too far from calling the Winnipeg Goldeyes for a job

H.T. Ennis
Admin
Super Member
18 days ago

I am fairly sure he will get a Major League deal? Am I super off here? I’ve seen this opinion multiple times.

Eric_in_Portland
Super Member
18 days ago
Reply to  H.T. Ennis

I might be the only one here who thinks it’d be ok to bring him back.

JackFrost
Super Member
18 days ago

No. Please no.

H.T. Ennis
Admin
Super Member
18 days ago

I just said the same thing in the writers chat! I actually think there’s around a 30% chance it happens!

gitchogritchoffmypettis
Super Member
Reply to  H.T. Ennis

HARR DARRR YARRRR MEDIOCARRR! Where is the white hot fire to put titillating product all over the diamonds? I demand that everybody we sign is at least as good as Bob Gibson. Why don’t you care about this team?

2002heaven
Trusted Member
18 days ago
Reply to  Jim Atkins

comment imagecomment image
Chris Bassitt, Kevin Gausman, Anthony DeSclafani have to all be replaced somehow.

Eric_in_Portland
Super Member
19 days ago

I just watched this entertaining video of all of Shohei’s HRs. Great fun except too many times the scores were depressing. Colorado 10, Angels 2. Houston 10, Angels 5. That sort of thing. On occasion, though, we went ahead, like when Heandog served up one.

https://youtu.be/TM0YQZdRKGw

Last edited 19 days ago by Eric_in_Portland
Jeff Joiner
Editor
Super Member
18 days ago

Thanks for stealing my material for the weekend links, ha ha.

Some of those are pretty cool.

Eric_in_Portland
Super Member
18 days ago
Reply to  Jeff Joiner

it’ll hold up on repeated viewings!

gitchogritchoffmypettis
Super Member

Sooo…. if I were Pedro Martinez I’d be able to argue most of his HR were garbage runs? Low leverage? Unclutch? a 3 on the Jeter scale?

MarineLayer
Trusted Member
19 days ago

The Detroit Tigers comp tells us how far we have sunk, and they have the advantage of being well into a rebuild with lots of spare money to sign whoever they want.

Senator_John_Blutarsky
Super Member
Reply to  Charles Sutton

He’s probably as good as any one else out there. Constantly chasing the coach who’s staff had a great season is a losing proposition.

Give Wise the pitching talent. If he screws the pooch then, provide him with some lovely parting gifts and move on.

gitchogritchoffmypettis
Super Member

Your common sense approach just isn’t committed enough to winning. We need to go through pitching coaches like Darth Vader goes through Admirals to show people who super cereal we are about winning.

Senator_John_Blutarsky
Super Member
FungoAle
Super Member
19 days ago

Let’s not settle on familiarity. Should always seek to see who is available. I am hoping for a change. My gut feel is that Perry and Joe will be lazy and stay the status quo.

Last edited 19 days ago by FungoAle
matthiasstephan
Trusted Member
18 days ago

We have to give him credit for improving the players we had, right? Seems like lots of young kids went out and kept us competing, long after the writing was on the wall.

FungoAle
Super Member
18 days ago

If I read where Sandoval and Suarez (the only 2 pitchers that I am aware of) extend accolades and appreciation towards Wise, then I’ll retract.

gitchogritchoffmypettis
Super Member
Reply to  FungoAle

I’m sure Wise is sweating bullets hoping you react favorably to him.

matthiasstephan
Trusted Member
18 days ago
Reply to  FungoAle

So, just to be clear – a pitcher pitches badly = fire the pitching coach. A pitcher pitches well = no proof the pitching coach helped at all (without verbal confirmation which you have seen personally)?

Is that about the sum of it? (Also, you are only aware of two of our pitchers?)

Jeff Joiner
Editor
Super Member
19 days ago
Reply to  Charles Sutton

Bundy and Q fell off a cliff this year. However, Sandoval, Suarez, and Detmers showed some nice upside and improvement over the year.

Yeah, I think he sticks.

JackFrost
Super Member
18 days ago
Reply to  Charles Sutton

Don’t think we can give him credit for that since Shohei is likely someone they simply leave alone, both as a hitter and pitcher (at least Joe intimated at that).

Senator_John_Blutarsky
Super Member
Reply to  Charles Sutton

(In my best gitch voice) HARR DARRR TRICIA YARRRR. 😎
Clearly Ohtani would have won every game he pitched of it wasn’t for Wise. In fact, Ohtani would have pitched in more games if it wasn’t for Wise….and Arte.

gitchogritchoffmypettis
Super Member

I see you too have the gift of hyperbole.

Twebur
Super Member
19 days ago
Reply to  Charles Sutton

#1 problem for a long time has been the pitching staff……most of the blame falls on the GM’s.

Someone better is available, do it. Doubt that Mr. Wise is a guru that we will regret losing. Or, maybe Perry will construct a staff that doesn’t suck and Wise becomes the next Ron Perranoski.

https://www.baseballamerica.com/stories/why-mlb-teams-look-to-college-baseball-for-pitching-coaches-but-not-managers/

gitchogritchoffmypettis
Super Member
Reply to  Twebur

If they keep Wise, fine. He was fine. If they try someone else, also fine, it’s not like Wise is makin aces from nothing. I mean sure, he made #3-5 pitchers from nothing plus what ever Cobb is, and Warren…. but I don’t think Wise is the best ever.

FungoAle
Super Member
18 days ago

I bet you will break his heart when he reads that he is not the best ever.

gitchogritchoffmypettis
Super Member
Reply to  FungoAle

Nah. He’ll shrug and agree cause it’s true and I’m not some chuckle head coach dad withholding my approval from him like he should give a shit.

He’ll be fine. And if he gets replaced it will probably be by someone better and he’ll probably get a job someplace. He molded a fine sculpture from pooh this year.

2002heaven
Trusted Member
18 days ago
Reply to  Charles Sutton

Rather have Bud Black back.

gitchogritchoffmypettis
Super Member
Reply to  2002heaven

Yeah, his plan will be titled Have Them Pitch In Petco.

H.T. Ennis
Admin
Super Member
19 days ago

24.6% chance to make the playoffs per ZiPS in 2022. Lesigh

JackFrost
Super Member
19 days ago
Reply to  H.T. Ennis

Chance that either Trout, Ohtani, or Rendon will not miss substantial time due to injury :
4.2 %

Twebur
Super Member
18 days ago
Reply to  JackFrost

It just dropped….2.6%. It rained yesterday.

FungoAle
Super Member
19 days ago
Reply to  H.T. Ennis

They could be expanding the playoff eligibility that would render that number low.

JackFrost
Super Member
19 days ago
Reply to  FungoAle

I was kind of joking with that number.

But I think you get the point.

Nothing else matters if we cannot stay healthy next season.

FungoAle
Super Member
19 days ago
Reply to  JackFrost

I’m going to be betting on the Halo’s winning the pennant/seeks before Perry makes his killer acquisitions and sinks the odds.

Last edited 18 days ago by FungoAle
Fansince1971
Super Member
18 days ago
Reply to  H.T. Ennis

What the F does ZiPS know? Kind of silly to make that kind of prediction right now without knowing what the team will look like. There are too many so-called experts in the world now and the internet is a haven for anyone with an opinion. Kind of like all of us.

My suggestion, lets at least get to February 2022 before we start discussing the Angels statistical changes in 2022.

And what did this so called ZiPS swami say the Giants chances were in 2021?

Heck at this point we do not even know if there will be a season due to pending lockout and possible strike!

H.T. Ennis
Admin
Super Member
18 days ago
Reply to  Fansince1971

I mean, I trust ZiPS more than myself, personally. But you are free to keep your opinion.

gitchogritchoffmypettis
Super Member
Reply to  H.T. Ennis

I prefer steamers because I like the word steam. I got a VHS tape of Alyssa Milano’s 80s Jazzercise video entitled Teen Steam at a thrift store many moons ago. Now thousands of women have their political opinions informed by that very same woman. No one can project the future.

Simba
Member
18 days ago

Certainly true as regards humans and politics. Who would have thought the stars of Bedtime for Bonzo, the Terminator, and The Apprentice would become political leaders?

gitchogritchoffmypettis
Super Member
Reply to  Simba

Also, who knew bad tasting products that help women who are nervous about their pooh would become a multi-billion dollar industry? Plus, pet psychologists… the Gathering of the Juggalos. Life is a trip Holmes.

Twebur
Super Member
GrandpaBaseball
Super Member
19 days ago

Braves are without their best player and weak pitching will doom them. (Acuna).

Be nice to see Brewers go deep. I think they will get to the World Series.

GrandpaBaseball
Super Member
19 days ago

I would like to see the Rays win a World Series.

I hope to see the Yankees and Astros have short terms in the Playoff battles.

steelgolf
Super Member
19 days ago

Interesting write up of how they call The Dodgers winners, for getting Scherzer to cover for the injured Kershaw and completely forget to mention the Bauer debacle.

gitchogritchoffmypettis
Super Member
Reply to  steelgolf

If you are Real Men of Genius who are super extra committed to winnership and pumped grit then you totally spend 90 million dollars filling two rotation spots.

AnAngelsFan
Trusted Member
19 days ago

So Long, Don.

angelslogic
Super Member
19 days ago

I sincerely hope the Angels FO fires ALL the batting coaches, pitching coaches, training staff, and then themselves on the way out the door. Let a completely new crew take over the helm.

gitchogritchoffmypettis
Super Member
Reply to  angelslogic

Honestly, I’d be happy if they just put Kuhl/Carpino on an ice flow. Baby steps.

steelgolf
Super Member
19 days ago

I was hoping Arte would move them over to marketing his development of the stadium property, but alas, he probably has them doing both.

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