As people were ready to stop f5-ing for the day, Perry came through with the signing of Jose Quintana for 1 year, 8 million dollars. He turns 32 in a few days, and had a 0 BWAR and a 4.5 ERA in 2020 in 4 starts, but hey, 1 year deal and he can pitch!
If he can throw 170 innings of league average pitching, that is good enough for me really. The Angels need an innings eater that is not giving up a ton of runs. He was previously on the Cubs.
Julio Teherán again
if he was still any good why would he come here on his own volition?
I’m having a sense of deja vu
Oh boy, the Dipoto four.
This presser is what you end up with when you burn most of your budget on a unrepentant, narcissistic cokehead.
No the Eoobler Four of 2019 😖
Hahrvey, Boor, Ahllen, Cayehill…..ugh!!!
Here.
Might be one of the most uncomfortable photographs I have seen. It looks like an apologetic father who is attempting to explain the bad behavior of his 4 boys.
2020 thumb and lat injuries, but usually durable. 19th on the 2021 MLBTR Top FA List. Essentially took the year off, so he should be fresh. I wanted to trade for him, Chatwood and Contreras last offseason, which would have sucked in hindsight.
38 year old JA Happ just signed with the Twins for the same amount. I’ll take Quintana.
Tanaka (10th), Odorizzi (11th), Walker (23rd) or Richards (24th) would be fine as the 2nd FA starter if Arte oks it. Interesting that both Tanaka and Odorizzi got hit by line drives last year. Remind you of any former Halo hurlers?
I thought we had a new GM?
so annoying dude
Oh, you just don’t like super hot takes from a dude who spits out hard truthy bullets like a machine gun at Gallipoli, shredding the soft pink flesh of Pollyanna Angels fans who don’t want to see the hard gritty truth behind Arte’s jovial jive and butt courting seat sales like so many young Aussie men.
Can we trade the burner phone dude for Mouse Tits and Johnny Rivers yet?
more.jp
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Otra Vez?
I won’t have a real opinion of Perry until spring camp starts. Anything is possible. Signings, trades. We all know more will happen so I’m gonna sit back and relax.
…and enjoy an Ale or two. I’m with you. I enjoy this time of year, being a mini-GM waiting and hoping for new players to help the team. The only pressure I have is keeping the ice box full of adult alcoholic beverages.
Same man, I’m going to sit back and enjoy it.
That said, with all the one-year deals we have, and with a number of free agents next year, we *COULD* give Bauer a significant deal and go over the LT for one year, then likely go back below next year without any issue.
The taxes on overage are minimal as long as the team stays below going over by 20mil, which means as long as we keep payroll below 230mil, we would have just a small penalty. Something for Arte to consider, if he truly wants to go for it.
Incredible luck and stupidity are not two strategies we should pursue!
We are better by all of Perry’s moves, no question in my mind. Before this signing, I had actually came to the conclusion after the Musgrove trade, that Perry is just not interested in trading key prospects from a thin 26th rank farm system. Probably wants and deserves a year for he and his team to develop a closer opinion on what the hell the stepped into. The Musgrove trade, IMHO, seemed like a chance worth taking. A player like Knowles, Jerimiah Jackson and a Barria might have gotten us somewhere. But Perry is keeping the prospects, keeping all of them.
So, he signed Quintana and I am guessing, another 3rd tier FA coming. Actually, I’m quite fine with that, it does raise the floor and provide depth. We shall see how well they pitch. I really would like to see the remaining funds secure one of the better FA relievers left and nab a couple more on cost friendly deals (see who drops on our lap). Continue to beef up the pen. Bonus would be to acquire one more everyday OF once Upton starts the season batting under the Mendoza line.
I could still see a trade for Gray possibly. His salary would fit our budget and while it’d cost us some prospect capital, I could see it for a SP like him that likely won’t require Adell to be shipped off.
If not, and we sign someone like Paxton or Odorizzi to fill out our rotation, then while it may feel ab it disappointing, we’d still have a rotation of Bundy, Heaney, Paxton/Odorizzi, Quintana, Canning, Ohtani. Sandoval in AAA and Barria could either be in the bullpen or start if someone is hurt in spring training (which seems like a decent bet to occur).
It’d be creating depth at a position where we have little, and that definitely holds value. We have an elite offense and a fairly strong defense, so we can probably get by with good but not amazing SP.
Yeah. A trade where we pick up salary is far more likely, but I am tempering my expectations even for that. Unless the Padres have just become “Team Overpay”, which I suspect they have to a slight extent, the pile of prospects they sent to the Cubs, guys that were in the teens of their top 30 but would be in our top 10, means there are a lot of teams who may be able to offer more for a guy like Gray.
Basically, we can’t bemoan our horrible farm, while dreaming on the good pitching we will get via trades from the horrible farm stupid Eppler built. Though I have some hope. Given what we have managed to get in trades with our farm thus far I am not sure everyone in the MLB thinks it’s total crap. So maybe the Reds have a few prospects of our in mind that they like.
There in lies the problem. Perry has to give the farm a good look because it’s thin, probably too thin to pull off a major pitching trade without losing two of our top 5 prospects. Knowles, Jackson and Barria for Musgrove sounds good to me, trouble is, those prospects are all not as good as what Pitt got, and Barria is likely not as good as Luccaci. If I were Perry I’d look at what the trade market is doing and set a goal to be able to do something similar within the next couple of years so he can trade for “the last big piece” when all this talk of being champcaliber is more realistic. We won’t be nearly as deep as the Padres system, but being able to trade like they have to a lesser extent would be great. Right now we just don’t have the horses. Our #7 prospect is their #27.
I am hoping in a couple of years we have a top OF piece expendable to trade (Adell, Marsh, Jackson, Adams) and a top IF prospect (Jackson, Paris, Knowles) that people want, without taking away all of our depth.
We are moving towards that, but our depth there is young and not yet proven.
If we can get two starting OF and a SS out of our prospect pool moving forward, and with Pujols and Upton coming off the books, we would be in a position to pay for top pitching talent (with the extra prospects, or the freed up money).
We shood just tank
because we can’t draft and develop good players on our own and thus we need no brainers like Zion Williamson in the NBA or soon to be Clemson QB Trevor Lawrence in the next NFL draft.
I like this signing. Quality arm and you can always find a spot for more pitching if it happens. Bauer is playing the game as is his right but the musical chairs game most likely isn’t going to end well for Angel fans. Too many rich suitors and a dubious history with our Pitching Coach.
Admittedly, I am a bit surprised at the degree of pessimism I am seeing here, as well as the references to previous 1-year deals signed by our former GM.
Quintana has generally been a 3-4 fWAR pitcher in his career. Even if he *only* is, say, a 2 fWAR pitcher this year, that’s still a very significant value at 1/8.
If this is the only SP move we make, it is obviously disappointing, but I suspect there will be another significant SP addition.
Quintana is a solid mid-rotation pitcher when healthy, and on a team with very little SP depth, that’s a huge addition. It pushes Sandoval to AAA, where he serves as immediate depth.
Thank you, I agree. The current rotation is Bundy + a bunch of guys we hope will “achieve their potential.” Quintana instantly becomes the #2 guy in that rotation. Now, if he’s still the second best pitcher we have when the season starts, that will be depressing. Even if this is just a dumpster-diving move, Perry’s digging in a trash can in a richer neighborhood than Eppler was.
This offseason basically reminds me of every offseason under Eppler. Anyone who truly believed things were going to be totally different with Perry and that the Angels do not need a Baseball Organization with Arte not involved are delusional.
I don’t know. If you want to see mediocre off season go look at the Angels 2001-2002 offseason transactions.
Well if we had Salmon, Erstad, Anderson, Glaus, Kennedy, Bengie Molina all in their prime as well as Washburn, Ortiz and Percival and then Lackey as well as KRod in AAA – I would not be so negative.
No. In January of 2002 you and most of the people on this site would be bitching and moaning about how Salmon is washed up and Erstad looks like a bust who mostly hasn’t lived up to his #1 pick status. You’d be complaining about names like Wally Joyner, Glenallen Hill, Jeff DeVannon and Tony Fernandez. You would be totally meh about Jarrod Washburn and you’d be even less enthused about Ortiz who was not nearly as good as Quintana is right now at the time. You would have barely heard anything about Lackey or K Rod because they were meh prospects. Same with Scott Shields, he’d be exactly the type of no name option we all complain about now at that point. You would be moaning about the loss of Jim Edmonds and eventually complain about us picking up Kevin Appier. You’d be frustrated that guys like Lou Pote, Ben Weber, Brendan Donnely and Scott Shoeneweise are who our stupid GM seems to think will take on the likes of the Yankees and Mariners…. oh, and we’d be wasting Glaus’s prime window.
Ha! Wow. You relish being a contrarian like some people relish a proper prime steak.
The point is, retrospect or not, the 2021 Angels need a lot more help than the 2001 Angels. We have had 5 years of band-aids and this offseason does not seem much different- other than the addition of a real closer (which can be compared to Eppler’s first move acquiring Simba).
I see no plan, no Orhanizational commitment to one side or the other. (Rebuild or Win!) It’s more of the ‘competitive’ BS that consistently results in the team fielding a #8-#12 draft pick.
Are you predicting the Angels catch lightening in a bottle again 20 seasons later? Or are you argumentative solely because you like arguments?
Oh and just for the record, in the 2001/2002 offseason, I was pretty optimistic about the Appier and Sele signings. The 2001 starters had been 4th best in ERA and I thought a starting rotation of Washburn, Appier, Ortiz, Sele and Schoenweis was pretty decent.
So…..You’re saying there’s a chance!
Actually, here….
2020 OPS .763, OPS+ 108, WHIP:1.31, FIP:4.49
2001 OPS.773, OPS+105, WHIP: 1.27, FIP:4.25
And here’s what’s good… 2020 Dodgers
OPS .821, OPS+ 121, WHIP:1.06, FIP:3.71
I’m argumentative solely because you expressed something that is wrong. Your feelings now, or in 2001 don’t matter. What we have now is just about the same as what we had in 2001. Thus if you felt better in 2001 than now it’s all on you, not what PTP has done. I’m not contrarian, I’m right.
As for lightning in a bottle, based solely on my gut, I think the guys we have now have a better chance of it than the 2001 guys. I think Trout, Rendon, Upton, Ohtani, J Iglesias and Fletcher are potentially a lot better than what we had then while the pitching is a toss up. Depends on how guys like Ohtani and Canning do. Either way, both groups would need to catch lightning in a bottle to really win out.
Also though, dude, nobody expected Brad Fullmer to come through with the steroids hookups. We had a few boosted players in there for sure. But so did everyone, so it is what it is.
Or go look at the 20 other teams out there that are far more mediocre year after year after year. The team that PTP has been putting together will compete. If we are lucky and guys like Ohtani and Upton produce we will be pretty good. Thus the wailing has to be about how this team can’t compete with the Padres, Dodgers, Yankees and Braves…. well, yes, probably not. Not yet. But we have far more hope for regular contention under Arte than 2/3 of the MLB and I like the brain trust PTP has been putting together. It’s just not the instant shiney trophy carb load some fans want, but the truth is 9 out of 10 times a team like the Braves is going to kick our ass no matter what we do this off season.
And a GM who used to work for the Braves would know that.
Cleveland Browns just passed us ( won just one game in two seasons in 2016 and 2017 and winless ) and were the laughing stock of the entire sports world a few years ago!! They made the playoffs and won a playoff game after 18 yrs and 12 years of consecutive losing seasons. The absurdity of this all is Arte has MLB’s 8th highest revenue generating team ( ahead of the Nationals, Giants, Rangers, ChiSox, Phillies, and Mets……No excuses!! ) 😣
Great signing? No. It’s a “do no harm” signing to get the team through 2021. Perry is playing the long game with 2023/2024 likely being the objective where the ship starts to really turn.
To quote a great halosphere soothsayer: “we will win some games” in 2021. “Winning some games” has always been Arte’s goal, and Perry is here to implement Arte’s goals.
Same long game this team has been playing since 20 forever. They have been stop gapping since 2015, and not drafting first round pitching, then flummoxed as to why the team can’t finish the season making the playoffs. This is just another continuation of 2016, but hey, maybe they will finish at .500 !
“maybe they will finish at .500 !”
Hope springs eternal…..
As usual, mediocrity is the price we pay for having too many bloated contracts and a bad farm.
Even with more moves still to make this is already the highest Opening Day payroll in club history. If we add more pitching it will have to be for someone young and cheap which means high price in prospects (Adell, Marsh, Detmers etc)
Saying “this is the highest Opening Day payroll in club history” means close to nothing. It does not take into account inflation and the rise in average salary etc,
If you wanted to say something that is actually meaningful about our 2021 payroll and it’s standing in Angels history you would have to compare it to other clubs payroll’s and where we are ranked now and/or in seasons past relative to other teams in that particular year/season.
OK. Point I’m making is I am *quite* doubtful there is much more money to spend coming off a pandemic
As everything else, looks like Perry is putting band-aids on until next year where Pujols is off the books.
Which, well, sucks obviously. But at least it is A pitcher acquisition so it is SOMETHING.
Just based off “feel” this team seems even worse than last year heading into the season. With a new GM you should feel inspired but this team is tanking without tanking
Because we added a starter and revamped the bullpen? We didn’t lose any FA that we didn’t replace (Simba).
Could/Should we do more? Sure. But I am confused at the case for ‘worse’
Upton and Pujols are a year older and worse. Adell is not nearly the same hope he was (falling down prospect lists). . Ohtani is further removed from any pitching success and his bat regressed terribly and is injury prone . Canning did not emerge as a middle of the rotation pitcher. We swapped Simba with J Iglesias.
So, it is the same as last year (were Upton and Pujols good then? Evidence they will be worse than that this year?). If Ohtani improves/regains form, that is a bonus. Can’t be worse than last year (and not penciled into the rotation, nor a starting position player, so…?).
Plus, we have another pitcher in the rotation, and improved bullpen (the other Iglesias), and Simba has been injured so Iglesias might be an improvement there (and Fletcher at 2B is an improvement over Rengifo there).
I don’t see a case for things having gotten worse, just not improved as much as you hoped (yet, in the middle of January).
Seems like we’re poised to be a bit better since we know Adell isn’t ready and may plug a veteran in there who out-produces him by a mile.
Same with the possibility of more Jared Walsh over Pujols…the offense could be significantly better.
Exactly. I don’t get the negativity around here right now. Iglesias alone is a massive improvement. If we had him last year instead of the merry-go-round of suck we had for closers, we’d have made the playoffs. I’m confident that over 162 games Iglesias keeps something like 5-10 more games in the win column than last year’s bullpen.
Walsh over Pujols is another subtle but big improvement. I don’t expect Walsh to keep up the tear he was on at the plate, but if he can OPS in the mid-.700s with 15-20 HRs and keep Pujols under 300 ABs it’s a huge gain. Really no reason barring several injuries for Pujols to be more than an expensive bench player on this roster.
We were always going to sign at least one pitcher like Quintana this offseason. That’s done now, so let’s see who else we get.
Good points about Iglesias and the Closer role. I agree.
In addition, I don’t want to pass judgment on Perry since the off-season is not over yet. If we don’t add a significant (“very good”) SP I will however be disappointed.
In reality, I think 5 years from now, if anything is the BIG PICK UP from this off season it will be the pile of brains Perry brought into the FO. I think he’ll be allowed to build a pipeline. I am betting Arte has seen the elephant, sees how other teams are pulling things off, and wants that for his team.
Speaking of brain piles, how many people did Eppler bring with him from the MFY when he arrived in Anaheim? I suspect the Yankees didn’t let anyone with any brains leave. I know that there was a slight brain drain that left the Angels to go to Seattle with Dipoto and i was never too sure how Eppler filled those vacancies.
Relative to PTP it seems obvious to me that he at least had a plan when he came here including what potential personnel would join him and how he will staff the front office. Time will tell what the Platypus gets away with if it isn’t for that meddling Arte, but, unlike Eppler, so far, I am encouraged.
I want to see 2 things. There will be a “great reset” in the MiLB system when ever they reopen. A lot of our prospects will be having a semi-new start. Let’s see if any of the meh becomes really exciting. Though I doubt we’ll hear anything, let’s see if any tales of new training or scouting methods leak out. Also, the draft. I want to see if Perry and Friends draft differently.
Your belief in Arte’s willingness to change is stronger than mine….
True, though we are probably coming from the same source. Arte will change because he wants to make money. It is so much easier to do things like build stadiums and complexes when they are built around a beloved team that is winning and has the OC abuzz with pride and joy. Plus, home grown pitching is cheap, and he’ll love that, and Perry knows how to make that.
Word.
If this is “tanking”, the Angel front office requires remedial training on how to effectively “tank”. What the franchise has been doing is signing “big name” free agents in the twilight of their careers – and winning just enough games to keep fans watching games, buying tickets, and buying merchandise.
Oh dear god, no…not what I was expecting. Don’t hate it but underwhelmed and will need to embrace it, somehow. Too far removed from his effective years. History not on our side.
Watched him pitch many times since he arrived in Chicago, North side. Does not miss many bats and gets hit hard. As stated below, the type of factoids we were saying about Tehran last year. Aka Need an innings guy, dependable, puts ball in play…Quintana is able to get by at times with a good defense, but does not dominate, does not pitch deep into games, 4th or 5th starter. Would you have Quintana start a playoff game? No you would not. Having said this, better 1-year on José than a 3-year Odorizzi. This won’t move the needle considerably and feels again, like a we are in a holding tank until next year FA crop and one more year off the Trout Legacy.
Fingers crossed, hoping for the best and remain positive. What is next?
Doesn’t pitch deep into games? well, he will fit right in and we can expect the bull pen to be toast by July 1st !! TrAdition.
Lefty with a good groundball rate (something this team desperately needed considering their outfield defense) who can soak up some innings. I can dig it. Just need a top of the rotation type to slide everyone down a slot in the rotation.
Hoping this turns into a trade by the deadline.
Oh pooooh. I wanted Shane Beiber and 2016 Chris Sale. Does this guy come with a 100% guarantee of health and ability? If not we need to go get one of those 100% certain to be good pitchers that are just sitting there waiting for Arte to pony up. I don’t unastan why we didn’t just trade Yunel Escobar and Jam Jones for Sack Pleasac.
First time Yunel Escobar has crossed my mind in a few years
Meditate on Yunel my friend. If we had traded him and Kole Calhoun we would surely be awash in ace pitchers as we speak.
I don’t I kind of wish we could have Trevor Gott back
The guy Yunel could hit but flakey as all hell and had a stone glove.
See I like it, I get people are saying he’s Teheran 2.0 but to be honest I don’t blame him. He was injured during spring training, got the virus before summer training and never really got to work with Callaway as the others improved towards the end as they worked with him more (Barria small sample, Canning a bit longer). 1 for 8mil isn’t small but it’s not a Harvey who hasn’t recovered from years before he signed with us.
I would also like to add that he at least played okay in 18 and 19 before getting injured this year, Kluber was hurt in 19 and this year and still got 11mil out of the Yankees.
I will let you. I think this is a good point. But I can’t speak for the others
Tehran out performed his peripherals year in and year out. Quintana actually pitched to his. He’s much less likely to see the floor drop out.
Which would only make this better correct? I saw someone say 2020 is an outlier for Quintana, would you say that could be the case or the start of a trend?
2020 is too bizarre for me to make much of anything out of it.
I do know the Central was bad (look at all the best pitching numbers) and that Quintana had a nasty cut on his hand.
Quintana is so much better than Teheran. Teheran always had bad peripherals and his best ever season was a 3.4 WAR in 2014. Quintana met or exceeded that every year from 2013 to 2017. He could be a viable 2/3 in the rotation. The only issue is that we still don’t have a bona fide ace.
Hopefully we have another starter coming, but this deal by itself is nice. Quintana almost always puts up a FIP below 4. In his last 8 seasons his FIP has been below 4, 7 of those years. He is consistently undervalued IMO and I honestly like what Perry has done this year.
so with this signing we still have 2 spots left on our 40 man and less than 4 weeks until P&CR. Any suggestions any ideas how to fill them?
I personally would be okay with Paxton (if he can handle his health finally) and/or a trade for a starter. If not them I’ll take a relief pitcher or two.
How about a right fielder? The Wunderkids seem to be at least a year away.
Not for big money I don’t want one, we do have schebler, we can try utility players, there are options. If we can get someone at schebler’s price sure. This however is my opinion, I just don’t like the idea of spending a lot on a new position player.
How about bringing back Brian Goodwin? We could probably sign him for about $2M ( plus incentives) I would guess he has something to prove after the way last year ended. Schebler will still cost about $1M if he makes the team. And like Schebler, Goodwin can backup if by chance Marsh or Adell are ready at some point during the season.
Yes exactly, Goodwin is the type of guy I’m talking about, not too expensive but solid. I liked Goodwin and hope we do give him another shot.
Goodwin is ok but glove is spotty. Perry is talking up a lot about run prevention.
Super ideally trade for Gray and sign Rosenthal.
In reality Tanaka and Melancon/Wilson are probably the best combo we can afford.