Good morning Angels fans, how are you this morning? Have some links!
Angels News
Angels are going after pitching. Shocker. Specifically Ray and E-Rod.
But Arte, however, wants a SS as the Angels are among half of baseball who are looking at the big 5 SS FA. 300 million dollar new SS, get used to it.
Speaking of, what IS the budget anyway? Perry doesn’t want to rule out anything.
Fletcher did not get a Gold Glove, but, Ohtani is the favorite to win MVP. Why? Just look at this chart.
All 6 MVP finalists are from non playoff teams, which means that both winners won’t be from playoff teams for the first time since 1987.
With C-rod out for 2022, the Angels need pitchers. Luckily, they may get Soriano back! But he would miss all of 2022 too. Um, at least Sandoval seems to be healthy?
Around Baseball
The other big award finalists were announced.
A’s blowing it up. Might be a prelude so they can move to LV with an excuse of ‘no fans’.
Mets, the Angels of the NL, are a mess. A new GM is still a ways away, and a new manager is even farther away.
Marlins may trade a starter. Interesting…
Reds may trade a number of players. Those are some nice starting pitchers you got there…
Baseball Prospectus argues for getting rid of the TV K-zone. Well, what do you think?
Anything I missed? Post below for upvotes!
I’m shocked! No 2002 uncaptioned pictures!!!!
He should be forced to show his cards…..go on record who he would sign, who he wouldn’t.
Eh. I bet he lists a lot of the same dudes I’d be OK with. His whole Captain Hindsight/Emoji Asperger’s thing is a separate deal for him. That’s some weird ass tick he has because Arte looks like a guy who stole his girl back in 1983 or something and Billy talks in complete sentences so he’s obviously high and mighty and needs to be taken down a peg… combine the two and it was just too much for ol’2002 to take. Like the dude has a glitch and can’t pee or something unless he attacks that duo first. So he just plops that stuff down whether it’s on topic or not.
But I bet if you had him do a “If I were Perry” it’d be just about as plausible as any of ours…. maybe a little slanted toward bat first OF that we don’t need, but not too out there.
Not to mention the frequent bathroom breaks.
Struggling to be brief I become obscure.
Horace
Struggling with my briefs I find it hard to remain obscure.
Thanks Jim Palmer.
https://youtu.be/6-6GbSy7x_k?t=37
The only 2002 uncaptioned picture I need.
Game Ball my Ass!
https://twitter.com/JeffFletcherOCR/status/1458512564812353538?s=20
https://twitter.com/JeffFletcherOCR/status/1458538553680400386?s=20
Trade him. Trade him now.
I’m gonna trade you to Lookout Landing if you say that again.
Hey, I’m not the one advocating for this. In fact I like my Ohtani jersey and don’t want to get rid of it yet. Its these guys:
https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/should-the-angels-trade-shohei-ohtani/id1461730531?i=1000541108966
Let me guess, they should trade him to the MFY.
The San Diego Padres Actually. for a package of Jake Cronenworth, Chris Paddock , Ryan Weathers & C.J. Abrams
Everyday and including Sunday.
Perfect way for an agent to answer. No comment = no speculation. Nice little bit on Perry to make the fans happy. Exit stage right.
So true, more of the ” we want everyone to know, enough of the past, we are trying.” But in the fans eyes” Nothing seems to be happening.” Hollow words. Demand a trade Shohei, shake their shit up.
Yes. Trade Ohtani. That should show Arte who’s boss…. somehow…. Kick his ass Seabass! In fact, I don’t think Arte will truly be shown and stuff till he only draws like 1M fans, so trade everybody for middle relievers and A Ball prospects! Let’s have a 40M payroll! Then we’ll have to watch that crap team for a few years while Arte still makes a ton of money…. but he’ll do it knowing that we know he knows that we know he knows that we won’t take something anymore and also he’s not the boss of the company he owns because we made it suck and now we’re gonna force him to do what nothing we can force him to do cause we had Seabass kick his ass. FLEX TOUGH! We are the spiritual embodiment of Oakley Razor sunglasses and we are going to talk about how we aren’t going to take this anymore!
Plenty of speculation, still. It looks to me like Ohtani’s agent explained to Perry that Ohtani’s willingness to sign an extension is dependent on the Angels demonstrating a commitment to win during the offseason.
So if we don’t get the pitching we want, the Angels are unlikely to be able to extend Ohtani too.
Famous last words.
And those who understand Japanese mores and culture (like DowningDude) will tell you that the Japanese will typically not tell you when they are unhappy in business negotiations. At the end of the day they will simply nod in agreement but then pull out or sign a deal elsewhere. You won’t know what hit you until it is too late.
Take heed Perry.
Yep. Gotta keep everything shrouded in cross cultural mystery so that our stupid front office doesn’t know what is about to hit them. Why would Ohtani hire an American agent to clearly define what he wants when he can keep things shrouded like the misty top of Mount Fuji because…. Japaneseness? Hell, he’s probably only survived the evil that glows from beneath tightly closed doors in the darkened halls of the FO because, when he’s not playing, he’s dressed like a Ninja, slipping from shadow to shadow, desperately trying to survive until he can do as his mother asks, because Japanese guys always do what their mom wants, and escape this fortress of evil.
Arte’s just too stupid to know all these 3D chess moves we understand. We should just trade Ohtani for Luke Voit now. Luke is simple.
Ha ha. It is funny how you have found a way to recycle that “Mom meme” for all things Shohei. I do actually think that is funny.
But you so often miss whatever truth may exist in many comments here by your exaggeration and turning said comments into caricatures. It is actually pretty stupid. There is a name for this ploy, it is called a straw man, and you love to do it.
I’m glad you understand it’s mostly kidding. What I use isn’t a straw man most of the time because usually I am making fun of total bullshit, not creating an exaggeration from a single instance to distract from the inarguable truth in a statement. I bust out a lot of ridiculous hyperbole.
The Shohei’s mom thing isn’t just a single inflated statement I use to distract from an otherwise factual argument. It’s the most extreme example of a completely clown show reach for dramatic alarmism… it’s also a little culturally neff, as though this whole contract extension with Shohei thing is going to hit the rocks because Shohei is too dense to figure out he’s working with a Mexican and a white fella, or work with American representation, and the Mexican/white guy are too stupid to make sure they are on the same page with Shoehei’s camp.
People can drop their “Look at me, I know about Japanese people and am thus 1/1000 closer to Shohei than normal” gas all they want, but in the end it’s gonna come down to how much money we can pay him and if the team seems to be going somewhere, same as if Shohei was from Orlando because Shoehei has been a very high level sports businessman for years now.
That’s why I mock it with hyperbole.
Again, you are not accepting something that is true. Japanese people in general do conduct themselves in professional environments differently than Americans do. This is a pretty well established fact that is understood by sociologists and people who have significant experience in both milieus.
For whatever reason you want to clown it and yes, you have exaggerated the argument for effect, which is a form of straw man. You are misrepresenting what was said.
“If the team seems to be going somewhere” is also a way of saying that Shohei cares about winning. This was a key point of mine. His agent can tell the world how happy Shohei is with the Angels, but if they do not actually make strides and improve the team (both on paper and in the W-L column) you can bet that Shohei is going to think long and hard before signing an extension, regardless of the money, which he can get in many other places.
And it remains true that the Japanese typically don’t express displeasure openly. Further, Shohei has not been here long enough to have become fully Americanized. If you don’t want to accept that, or don’t understand that too bad. The reality is the reality regardless what you think about it.
What I’m saying is that his agent is Americanized as f*** and leaving the intended target of a statement to wonder “what does Ohtani really mean? This Japanese stuff is so mysterious….” doesn’t accomplish anything for Ohtani and that Ohtani is smart enough to know that. Not that Japanese people aren’t different (Iknow they are, I’ve slept with one for a really long time) or that Ohtani has Americanized. This reality is also really real.
I mean, just look at the term “If the team seems to be going somewhere”… that’s not secret f***ing code.
Yes, on that point I agree. I also believe him when he says that “… I want to win. That’s the biggest thing for me.” Of course I don’t think that is code. Shohei Ohtani strikes out 10 against Mariners (mlb.com)
What I was really getting at is that being Japanese he would not likely say “I’m unhappy with the way things are going.” I don’t think he would be direct about any displeasure. That does not mean he wouldn’t say what is important to him or what he would like to see. It may seem only slightly different but it’s not. I don’t think he would be public about any displeasure. That does not mean he might not feel that way however…
In any case, the simplest thing for the Angels is just to put the best team possible on the field and continue to support Shohei in achieving his goals. After that they could in good conscience let the chips fall where they may.
Have to agree. Japanese culture or not, Ohtani has shown to be someone who doesn’t necessarily make money his #1 reason, so our offering to him, no matter how large in amount, might also want to include “winning” in it for our sakes.
Yeah, that is true. I’m not moved either way by what his agent says. All you had to see was Shohei’s face when the bullpen was getting crushed. Countless times.
https://twitter.com/TaylorBlakeWard/status/1458466167736057856?s=20
Very nice.
If Arte wants a Shortstop than I still think the best bet is Javy Baez. Joe should really know his strengths and deficiencies. Baez would probably prefer to play shortstop over second base and we may get him for less years and dollars than some of the bigger names with no lost draft pick.
Of course this is all predicated on the Amazin’s not doing something stupid. Which is always a very real possibility.
I don’t know how much I believe Heyman on this. Him saying a team is “in” on a huge FA is like saying I’m “in” on Kate Upton. While yes, I am technically in on that I suppose, I generally go about my business with many other priorities on my plate.
Would I be bummed out if we landed a big 5 SS? No. Those players are good. But I also need pitchers more. I’m willing to bet Arte knows this as well. If they lock down a bunch of pitching and then go crazy balls and sign a SS, fine. But I doubt we’ll end up with just a huge SS unless we pull a 2019 and chase a single big name pitcher until everyone’s off the market and then just pay a SS because we need one.
But the first thing that happened when I saw this was Heyman was my Twitter Translator kicked in and read “Because the GM meetings are happening Scott Boras stuck his fist into my puppet hole and made me say something to start driving up the market for shortstops so that fans start demanding and expecting 330M infielders. I feel alive again.”
“is like saying I’m “in” on Kate Upton. While yes, I am technically in on that I suppose, I generally go about my business with many other priorities on my plate.”
Great analogy, it made your point perfectly clear! 😀
I’m better looking than Verlander. So Kate is a money/Statis girl. Gitch is not in on Kate
No… no, Gitch es not mas macho.
No, No ,No ,No, Noooo?
At this point, everybody is in on everybody. A team that needs a SS is calling the agents for SS and gauging the market.
Heyman’s job is to make sure he links big market clubs to Boras players. I’m sure there’s a nugget of truth to most of his rumors, but they are mostly smoke.
That’s the term for this crap in this “Where the hell eat this will year!?!” off season… smoke nuggets. Just another smoke nugget from REPORTER.
I kind of think that with the COVID hymen Heyman has missed getting his puppet hole fisted by Borass
So we’re out on Verlander given your play for his wife?
Well, I am out on Justin. That dude is not welcome at my place at all. No Hot Pockets and grape Kool-Aid for Justin, only Kate.
I like Javy’s swag. I think that would help an “emotionless team” like the Angels.
Thinking about it the other day I looked up the numbers and we have enough players that can’t get on base and Baez will just add to that problem. Decent defensive numbers are good and of coarse he has power. I would like to see more and much better pitching that will create opportunities for us to win rather than trying to out score other teams in 12-9 games as 2-1 games are fun to win too.
The most Arte move possible would be signing Freddie Freeman.
Former MVP, slugger, great Christian guy, tied to OC. All Arte’s favorites boxes get checked.
A shortstop would make more sense, obviously.
And he is coming off a world series title so probably the desire to win has lessened. He’s perfect! Then we have a matching pair at the corners.
…and we can move Walshie to SS.
Better yet, he can pitch. Move him to the mound full time. We need pitching, don’t we?
or we can trade Walsh to AZ (Trumbo)
I’m starved of Angels baseball/ content. This is going to be a tough offseason. If only there was a good Angels podcast
Is there such a thing as a good Angels Podcast? When’s the CTPG gang going to drop one?
More awards pieces and some “If I were Perry” pieces are on the way. I’m not sure why no podcasts lately. Maybe we were all just too depressed.
Ooooooo can I write one?
Yes.
I know someone with an Angels podcast. If it’s any good i couldnt tell you. It’s called Rocks in the Outfield I think
The Heyman tweet says we are one of many “gauging” interest in the ss market.
That hardly means we are ready to pull the trigger on a big contract for Correa, Seager et al. Where is the proof that “Arte wants a SS..” ?
I don’t see any.
As for Ray and E-Rod I sure hope this is only a smokescreen by Perry. I imagine most of us will be ready to boycott the 2022 season if our top SP acquired is Robbie Ray.
That won’t cut it Perry.
I DO think we have reason to be concerned as Perry has said recently that there are “different avenues to acquiring pitching.” Perry Minasian talks Angels’ offseason from GM Meetings (mlb.com)
Is this code for “we aren’t going to spend alot on a top FA starter?” Maybe. Perhaps PTP will look to trade and add a second tier starter or even a third tier dive. If so we are in for another aggravating off-season of the Angels settling in the pitching department.
YES PERRY, DO IT! Poor the Skittles into the bowl of M&Ms and trade for Brad Keller while signing Mike Feirs! Then sign Trevor Story.
BURN BABY BURN!
Or, I don’t know, maybe do your job and talk to about a dozen pitcher’s agents who all represent pitchers who will be an upgrade?
No, wait. First announce an exact 2022 payroll number that makes my balls feel big so that every agent in the MLB can use us as a salary floor jack. Then chase only Max Scherzer for three months until he signs with either the Yankees or Dodgers. Then, now that every other arm is off the market, sign Joakim Soria, Jholis Chacin and Trevor Story. Got it? Perfect.
Look, I don’t blame him for not stating our budget or what our payroll will be. I was not one of the people complaining about that. I really get the art of “playing it cool.” However, sometimes one can read between the lines, ascertain the subtext and figure out what a GM is actually saying. I was cautious enough to use the word “maybe” because I understand that I am not inside Perry’s head and don’t know what is really going on… But I am also open to cues and clues when they are dropped.
Personally, I have never said the Angels should “chase only Max Scherzer” or suggested that our GM talk big. I care only about results, not talk. Time will tell if Perry’s interview was a smokescreen or if he has indeed decided to make an insubstantial trade for pitching while wasting Arte’s cash on a “Big Splash” ss. My fear is that we will again neglect our pitching problem and pass on the true quality that is available on the FA market, like we have for about a decade now.
I think everyone’s afraid of that, but I’m afraid that what ever is actually possible is “not going to cut it” for you. And though you’re just the latest guy to bring it up and far from the worst at it, I am a little sick of the idea that we always “pass” on the quality arms on the market. Let’s review…
Patrick Corbin. This “ace” was the arm that spawned the whole “if only Arte would pay a few million more we’d have him” whine. Even though he said from the beginning he wanted to play on the East Coast. We were in on him. He went to the East Coast…. and he sucks for 23M a year.
Yu Darvish…. is Yu Darvish… should we have chased that?
Charlie Morton. Yes we were in. He was not coming west.
Zack Wheeler: Took basically the same offer we made from the Phillies because his wife wanted Philly.
Steven Strausburg. Yep, we were in on him for a minute. That would have been rad.
Garrit Cole. Yep, we chased that pig all the way under the fence.
Trevor Bauer. This pig too. Real shame we missed on him.
For an owner that isn’t interested in signing top free agent arms Arte sure spends a lot of time chasing top free agent arms. This is part of why, this off season, I’d like to try actually just signing some fairly good pitchers and not courting a very old Max Scherzer for 3 months.
Then maybe we can all skip the pathetic seething takes where we cherry pick the “quality pitcher Arte wouldn’t sign” for 2022… next seasons version of Keuchel or Ryu or Gaussman.
Otherwise we are just left with a bunch of grown adults stamping their feet on the internet declaring that they ‘Don’t know who the Angels should have signed or how they should have pulled off a trade but damn it Arte needs to get it done!” which is some weak ass shit.
Well… now if Atre only had some Axe Body Spray
First, many of the guys you mentioned were people I was not actually interested in. Perhaps others in the community were, but for me Yu Darvish, Corbin, and even Strasburg (marginally; I was concerned about health issues) were not worthy of pursuit. The guys on that list I did really want were Cole and Bauer, Morton and to a lesser extent Wheeler.
I don’t think anyone thought Wheeler would become what he did become. If any GM knew that he would have made alot more money. I was disappointed about Morton choosing the East Coast, but I never blamed Arte for that. You keep mentioning him but I don’t think most of us here view that us a failure on the Angels part.
As for Bauer, well, let’s just be frank; nobody, not even you saw that coming. Alot of people knew he was a douche, but I don’t think anybody here imagined he was a violent, misogynistic psychopath.
Cole was a failure, whether you want to admit it or not. You mention that we were IN on these guys, but who the hell cares? No brownie points are earned for being “in” on a player. At the end of the day you either win or lose. And that goes for FA negotiations as well as the game itself. Arte clearly was not willing to spend what it took to win that game. The Yankees were willing. Plain and simple.
You have to pay for quality. What the Giants did with their FA acquisitions last season is highly unusual. It was unusual in the sense that that hit on almost all of those. We cannot expect to duplicate that kind of success rate. Most teams would not be able to do that in any given season.
If we struck it big on one mid-rotation guy like a DeSclafani we would STILL need to add a top of the rotation arm. There is no way around that. In order to win we will almost certainly need to add a Number 1 or Number 2 guy. In my thinking that comes down to Scherzer or Stroman. There would be an outside chance you get that out of a Ray, but as Jeff points out, it is pretty rare for a guy like that to follow-up a career season with another similar season. You might also get lucky that an aging Verlander coming off injury drinks from the fountain of youth and recovers his dominant form of a couple years ago. I would not want an expensive roll of the dice hoping for that however.
At the end of the day the Angels will show their commitment to winning in 2022 by their success in bringing in a top of the rotation starter, or conversely, they’ll show their lack of commitment by not doing so. Talk is cheap. Actions speak pretty damn loud though.
Just to brag, I signed Wheeler as my big deal in my “If I Was Eppler” piece. I did not know he’d be THIS good, though.
Well I had Randy Johnson signed in my “If I was Bill Bavasi ” facsimile newsletter but I never got my trophy either.
All I’m saying is Arte hasn’t just “passed” on the better arms on the market…. though we may have been better served if he had.
So Cashman announces that the Cap be dammed, the NYFY are hell bent to acquire top line pitching as though it was assurance to their fans and scare off other bidders. Cashman said also the Yankees need a SS.
I hope that PTP brings in Seager or Correa if we have to spend the money that this will cost.
Shohei Ohtani experienced and provided for the fans a once in a lifetime season so he certainly will win the MVP Award. Hands down with know else coming even close.
Why in the hell are you so focused on Correa and Seager? Neither one of those dudes are going to be a difference maker for the Angels in 2022. If we don’t fix the pitching we finish out of the playoffs. Guaranteed.
Yes!
Read what I wrote and it will become clear, “if we have to” meaning that the top guy says so. We need pitching more than hitting OK. Now that does not mean Arte believes that so……IF WE HAVE TO. Got it?
Sure, but this is not the only time you have mentioned signing these guys. You keep coming back to it. I am pretty sure you have stated that you “hope” we sign one of them…
IF WE HAVE TO. Apparently you have been missing the nuances in these finely calibrated expressions of the written language….
Grandpa – this team needs another high priced position player like it needs a hole in the head. Pitching. That is all.
And Yes.
Knowing Ohtani time is a year to two away (plus, an unheralded concern by us thus far, Walsh will probably cost some money soon) I just don’t see how Arte could look to spend much anywhere but pitching… unless it’s a short term cost hike that helps us add a pitcher in trade.
No GG for Fletch, travesty, travesty I say!
Thats what I felt too!
Although performance at the plate has nothing to do with a GG, Fletch’s suckage in the 2nd half likely played an oversized role in the outcome
Carlos Rodon has been available for three whole days and still isn’t on this team. Yet another failure by our FO.
I know. He’s pretty much the obvious Angel in the bunch. Sure to sign for five years and throw 250 innings over the life of his contract with a sweet sweet 4.20 ERA. I don’t know why we didn’t secret him away on a private jet as soon as the White Sox were beaten.