LA Angels Monday News Crash- ZIPS Line

This is the ZIPS projections for the Los Angeles Angels.  This is actually pretty cool, although they are bearish on Jared Walsh.  Hey!  We’ve poached Gene Watson from the Royals for our front office.  He appears to have a strong scouting background. The Angels tried, but they just couldn’t sign James McCann.  He has signed with the Mets.  Having lost out on the McCann sweepstakes the Angels appear to have pivoted toward Kurt Suzuki.

Non-Angels Links

Cleveland has finally decided to change its team name.  Tony La Russa pleaded guilty to misdemeanor reckless driving as part of a plea deal that allowed him to avoid being guilty of driving under the influence.  He is supposed to spend a day in jail, but the details of that are apparently still up in the air.  At the option of the authorities, you can be charged with misdemeanor reckless driving in Arizona for as little as driving 15 miles per hour over the speed limit.  This conviction will definitely look better on his record than a second DUI.

The winner of the auction of Johnny Bench memorabilia will be returning some or all of the items back to Johnny Bench.  That million bucks sure should help pay those college bills depending on what colleges those kids got into.  Corey Kluber will be throwing bullpen sessions for interested teams in January.  After a couple of injury plagued years, it make sense that people are not throwing money at him sight unseen.  Vince Velasquez, of the Phillies, is drawing trade interest.  The Angels don’t need any “projects” for their rotation right now.  I hope I can trust that Perry is really looking for “proven” arms this year. 

This kid apparently means business when he come up to bat. 

Photo credit: Rex Fregosi

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steelgolf
Super Member
3 years ago

The Cleveland Wokes. Then each season they can set their giveaway nights to the latest “woke” issue of the week.

Eric_in_Portland
Legend
3 years ago
Reply to  steelgolf

by 2023 you’ll be used to whatever they choose. Speaking for myself, I don’t usually think “Washington Wizards? No! Washington Bullets!” Or “Houston Astros? No! Houston Colt-45s!”.

steelgolf
Super Member
3 years ago

Or, I can treat it like I do other annoying name changes and keep calling them The Indians. I never used Edison Field for the Big A. In 2023 (3 years from now) they will still be The Indians unless they pick a crazy minor league team type name, like the Trash Pandas, then I’m all in.

Eric_in_Portland
Legend
3 years ago
Reply to  steelgolf

heh. I’m with you on ballparks. The Trailblazers play in something called “Moda Center” but I’ll only mention that name in circumstances like this when I point out how inferior it is to the real name “The Rose Garden”.

steelgolf
Super Member
3 years ago

Now with Tampa Bay, I always just called them The Rays since Devil Rays just seemed too long of a name for me to be bothered to say it correctly.

Jeff Joiner
Editor
Legend
3 years ago
Reply to  steelgolf

Slightly OT: I still, and probably will always, see LAC on the crawl and think Clippers not Chargers. Took me a good minute to figure out why the score in the “Clippers” game was so low for the second quarter just yesterday.

GrandpaBaseball
Legend
3 years ago
Reply to  Jeff Joiner

Oh my gosh, same here, so I’m not alone.

Eric_in_Portland
Legend
3 years ago

I see LARC and I wonder what that R is. Los Angeles Rams Chargers? That can’t be eight. I see this at CBS Sports

red floyd
Legend
3 years ago

Are you sure it’s not LAFC? LAFC is the soccer (Futbol) team that plays at Banc of California Stadium (where the Sports Arena used to be)

eyespy
Super Member
3 years ago
Reply to  steelgolf

If it is an MLB team. It’s the Angels and the rest of them bastards.

Don’t really care too much about team names to get my constitution all mixed.
But I do like the the W Football Team. That took some balls from Snyder, and he lost. Looks like his fans don’t give A shit either.

Last edited 3 years ago by eyespy
HalosFanForLife
Trusted Member
3 years ago

Cleveland Mistakes. Or get with the times, the Cleveland Karens.

GrandpaBaseball
Legend
3 years ago

Why have we not signed Garrett Richards? He’s due for a comeback season.

Mia
Legend
Mia
3 years ago

No one on Perry’s staff has any connection to him. He’s likely just another name on the board.

MH252525
Trusted Member
3 years ago
Reply to  Mia

True but I think we have a better chance to make a run at him than a random team. Trout is one of his best friends right? And we certainly need pitching.

Mia
Legend
Mia
3 years ago
Reply to  MH252525

I would hope Perry wouldn’t take a friendships into consideration when making decisions, If he decides a pursuit of Richards is in the best interest of the team, then it’ll just be a nice little bonus.

I think he’s likely on the same level as everyone else in his mind.

Could just be me, though.

WallyChuckChili
Legend
3 years ago
Reply to  Mia

Well… hopefully it stops with Gene Watson

Jeff Joiner
Editor
Legend
3 years ago

Garrett is probably the third tier and isn’t going anywhere for a while. He’s also probably not a solid rotation piece, either. So at this point in time we’re fine letting him float out there.

GrandpaBaseball
Legend
3 years ago

It is a sign of pride when a team uses Native American names. “Indians” shows strength not disrespect. Right now in NFL who wants any part of the Chiefs. This day of politically correctness is over the top imho…..Albert is predicted to have 15 HRs this coming season, if that’s correct then Ohtani will have failed or Walsh will have failed, either way we lose….Johnny Bench is the greatest catcher I have ever seen, and no sign of steroids there…..Why does everyone think that Fletcher is not going to pull down a 3 or 4 WAR? Two seasons in a row he has lead his team in Doubles and shows gap power. He is a great fielder at any position he plays. I will predict for the third year in a row that Fletch leads team in Hits and Doubles once again and finishes first or second in Runs Scored…..If I disagreed with a prediction of an Angels player it would be Heaney who has had only one really decent year and is injured and inconsistent way to much to depend on to much……One more prediction is if we get one more Bat and one more good Starter we will make the playoffs….BTW I believe that Walsh is the real deal and he will have a big season……

Gorbachav5
Trusted Member
3 years ago

I don’t think “pride” is exactly right. There is some evidence that the name “Indians” was chosen to honor Louis Sockalexis, Native American who played for the Indians (then Spiders) in the late 19th century. But there is plenty of evidence that while the name was chosen at least in part due to Sockalexis, it was also done in mockery and appropriation of anything to do with Native Americans. The Braves were popular at the time and people liked doing war chants and whoops and making grossly exaggerated caricatures of Native Americans. You can see a longer discussion of this here by one of my favorite baseball writers: https://mlb.nbcsports.com/2014/03/18/the-cleveland-indians-louis-sockalexis-and-the-name/ and here: https://sportsworld.nbcsports.com/cleveland-indians-nickname-sockalexis/

His conclusion is that it’s complicated. However, there are clearly some – Native Americans and others – who feel like the name is inappropriate. It has as much history of racism as it does of honor. As Posnanski states in one of those pieces, there was an opportunity to really lean into making the name an honor. But that hasn’t been done, and I think that there are some Native Americans who wouldn’t accept that no matter what.

Yes, you’ll find plenty of Native Americans who don’t care or actually like the name, some genuinely and some ironically. Yes, there are plenty of perpetually offended rich white people who are championing the cause for their own sense of getting something done and not due to any desire for social justice. That doesn’t mean the name should stay. It clearly is not a sign of pride for everyone who identifies as Native American and with a history fraught with mockery and racist appropriation, it’s time for it to go.

matthiasstephan
Super Member
3 years ago
Reply to  Gorbachav5

I agree. Just return the team to the Spiders, or the Blues (original Cleveland team).

eyespy
Super Member
3 years ago

Hitch has a good one. The River Fires. The fans can yell Cuyahoga! Whenever there is a home run.

Last edited 3 years ago by eyespy
Jeff Joiner
Editor
Legend
3 years ago
Reply to  Gorbachav5

A well reasoned, supported post showing there are multiple ways of viewing the same issue. You obviously don’t know how the internet works ha ha.

Seriously, great stuff and I completely agree. If they’d wanted to make a serious move towards honor they’ve had their chances. And while the name doesn’t bother me or my Native American buddies, we constitute a small sample size.

There is a bit of worry about the slippery slope. The perpetually offended rich white folks will find another name that offends them soon, perhaps even our Angels if I stretch quite a bit.

gitchogritchoffmypettis
Legend
Reply to  Jeff Joiner

Yeah. I think the Braves (having distanced themselves from the Tomahawk Chop) are more acceptable because they portray the NA people as a totem of strength and skill instead of Chief Wahoo. So they may be safer from KAren, though shehe will probably still complain some. Same with the Blackhawks and Canucks, etc. I think if, say back in the 80s, the Indians had made a switch to something more akin to the Indian Motorycles look, something that obviously says “We think NAs are cool.” it may have worked.

I always assumed they were the Indians because there were some seriously bad ass NA tribes in that area of Ohio that were the actual reason the fledgling US government was forced to pay for a standing federal army under Anthony Wayne’s command. There was actually a big war between the US and them and we barely won. Guess I was wrong.

Jeff Joiner
Editor
Legend
3 years ago

Look at what Florida State has done with Seminoles. They have a Seminole museum there, work to preserve the history of the tribe, really pushed the mascot as a tribute to the badass tribe.

I totally get why Cleveland named their team for a culture with a solid warrior tradition. The caricature was over the top but so is something in pretty much every Disney movie.

JackFrost
Super Member
3 years ago
Reply to  Jeff Joiner

As far as I am concerned if they had gotten rid of the Wahoo caricature that would have been enough. They then could have kept the name. Compromise, no?

Last edited 3 years ago by JackFrost
Jeff Joiner
Editor
Legend
3 years ago
Reply to  JackFrost

They ditched Wahoo a couple of years ago to my knowledge.

Personally I’d have taken it one step further and done some tribute to the tribes of the area and why the team honors them, like FSU did. Maybe an exhibit at the stadium, a link on the web site, some money going from the team’s foundation to NA causes. Things that show a little honor.

JackFrost
Super Member
3 years ago
Reply to  Jeff Joiner

I like this Jeff. I think those acts show a genuine interest in honoring that culture. Agree.

eyespy
Super Member
3 years ago
Reply to  Jeff Joiner

They ditched Chief Wahoo, but would keep rolling him out. They used that cap in the 2020 season if I remember right.

eyespy
Super Member
3 years ago
Reply to  Jeff Joiner

Doesn’t the Seminole tribe give the school money, after they purchased all the Hard Rock cafes and casinos?

Jeff Joiner
Editor
Legend
3 years ago
Reply to  eyespy

Not sure. I think I remember something about scholarships for Seminole kids or something years ago.

That’s about it.

eyespy
Super Member
3 years ago
Reply to  Jeff Joiner

Should have googled first. You are right, and FSU is still giving them out.

The Seminole nation is just rich on their own because of Hard Rock

ChillRIL
Member
3 years ago
Reply to  Jeff Joiner

Angels are too Christian, and therefore non-inclusive! I’m not a Muslim, or a Buddhist, or a Hindu, but I’ll go ahead and speak for them and channel what I assume is their outrage.

Seriously though, Cleveland will survive a name change. I’m sure that city’s been through worse. A pretty good friend of mine is Ojibwa and hates that mascot with a passion, and he also hates the Redskins. I’ve never heard him complain about other NA mascots. If only for his sake, I’m glad they’re moving on from Wahoo and all that. Some teams get buy in from local tribes, who help out with design questions and so on. In the end, pro sports are businesses, and no business wants to piss off potential customers with its name or logo…at least not businesses that aim for the general public as their customer base and not some niche.

JackFrost
Super Member
3 years ago
Reply to  Gorbachav5

What you said about the “rich white people” is an important point and that general idea is one of the keys to understanding the reactionary POC types.

So many of them are either as you say needing to feel valuable and noble, or, I think more importantly this focus on team names and insulting/offending behavior takes the focus off of making real, concrete economic and social changes that would truly uplift these marginalized communities.

In short, there are many other more pressing needs and issues to focus on for improving the lives of Native Americans than what nickname a sports team
has.

How many of those rich white people complaining have done anything in a concrete way to help them???

Last edited 3 years ago by JackFrost
Gorbachav5
Trusted Member
3 years ago
Reply to  JackFrost

I hope that what I said about rich white people was not the main thing you got from my comment. Mostly I included that to acknowledge that I am aware there are attention-seekers out there who aren’t really interested in social justice.

That said, I have zero problem with people who take up a cause like this for genuine purposes. I find that people who complain about “social justice warriors” or the “PC crowd” or “virtue signallers” are really just saying that they don’t like to confront their ignorance on racism (or sexism or homophobia) and they’re annoyed that they now have to change their behavior.

Does anyone really think it’s a bad thing that people care about the racist legacy of sports team names and want to change them? Your argument about there being more pressing needs and issues to focus on is certainly true, but recognizing that the name and iconography for a professional sports team is, at best, problematic does not mean those other issues will be more neglected than they were before. I hope that the people making an actual effort in this campaign are also making efforts to improve the lives of Native Americans in other ways. And I hope that this campaign raises awareness on issues that more significantly impact the Native American population. But most of the rich white people who furiously tweeted about these things wouldn’t have gone out and done anything else if they couldn’t take up this cause. They would have furiously tweeted about something completely meaningless. So it’s not like this cause was taking away from other work that needs to be done in this regard.

I’m glad that, at the very least, as a nation and a society we’re showing more concern for the legacy of racism in the country and we’re gradually pushing back against it. There are a billion steps left to take, and there is a risk that we pat ourselves on the back and say, “Job well done!” after a minor change like this. But hopefully these types of things are just the beginning of more impactful transformation.

JackFrost
Super Member
3 years ago
Reply to  Gorbachav5

Well, this is the key, further action and growth. If we really believe that successfully putting pressure on pro-sports franchises to change ethic sports names is a great achievement we are seriously deluded.

You said that doing so doesn’t mean advances in those other areas can’t be pursued. But that is just the problem; those rich white people (and other subcultures as well) often feel that making a stink about a name or a comment is actually enough. That means they have done their part.

That is why I ended my last comment with the question that I did. IF this mascot debate facilitates further discussion and leads to concrete social and economic changes, then yes, it will have been of value. But in and of itself it means very little. I can assure you it won’t end racism.

As for people who complain about “virtual signaling” as being afraid to confront their so-called ignorance on racism, I don’t agree.

I don’t like virtue signaling, and I am not ignorant about racism. The great majority of social justice warriors don’t even know what race is. They are mostly 20 something sock-puppets regurgitating college level rhetoric on racial inequality.

Race is a biological myth. It has been scientifically proven. Now, before the pc police descend on me, I’ll add that rascism DOES exist, despite the fact that race doesn’t. Race is a social construct, but ignorance and hate are very real.

So, yeah, I am in favor of raising awareness and educating. But let’s not make the mistake of believing that token gestures take the place of self-awareness, education and real economic and social progress.

Last edited 3 years ago by JackFrost
Gorbachav5
Trusted Member
3 years ago
Reply to  JackFrost

My point was that rich white people complaining on social media about injustices (real or perceived) is, for a certain percentage of them, the most they’re going to do. The people who truly care about racial inequality and social justice will spend a small portion of their time on a cause like this (i.e. changing sports team names with a racist legacy) and will spend a lot more time on effecting significant change. For the others, this might be all they do, which, while somewhat disappointing, is better than nothing. However, for some of those so-called “social justice warriors” or “virtue signalers,” this might be the gateway into getting more involved in the struggle for justice. They might enjoy their efforts in working for a just cause and decide to direct their time and money to further efforts. The bottom line is that I see no down side for any of these people.

I do think you’re begging the question when you call this a token gesture. At the same time, you’re setting up a strawman in your opening paragraph when you make it seem like everyone involved in this thinks it’s a great achievement. It is neither. This is a small, but meaningful change. It is significant because each one of these traditional institutions that gets torn down or changed or repurposed for honorific purposes is a sign that we recognize the legacy of racism and injustice in the country and we do not want to perpetuate it or celebrate it or even tacitly ignore it. Changing the name of the Indians harms no one, except maybe the owners who might take a small hit in the short-term in terms of brand recognition, but probably makes the them some additional money as they sell new merchandise. Who does it help? It’s not a simple answer, but at the least I think it helps de-objectify a historically oppressed group of people.

As I mentioned in my first post (which is just an idea taken from Posnanski, who wrote the pieces I linked), and Jeff follows up with nicely, there might have been a better way to do this. They could have used the “Indian” name as a launching point to honor and support local tribes. They could have come out, been open about the quasi-racist legacy of the name, and said that they want to use it to promote Native American culture. That would have been ideal, if it were possible. But it’s feasible they considered that option and determined there was no way to get that message across in a way that would be received as it was intended. As you’d agree, they took the easy way out, which is a bit of a shame, but also better than nothing.

The bottom line is that one team associated with a racist caricature of Native Americans is gone. That’s a good thing.

GrandpaBaseball
Legend
3 years ago
Reply to  Gorbachav5

I am one of the ignorant? My first wife was Japanese and we have two daughters together and a son. My son was adopted and is African American. My wife of 37 years is Mexican and we have to many children to count. Come down off your high horse before you stick a label on every type of person you perceive as “PC Crowd”. I do not follow any crowd, I am a leader in my own community. But I do believe that some facets of American life have just gone to far and in my book that is hardly being ignorant.
Yes, Chief Wahoo was over the top as was the Atlanta Braves being led by their owner and his girlfriend doing the tomahawk chop. I think that you may disagree with some who think different than yourself, but putting a label on people being ignorant is not being ignorant?
Social change is needed certainly, but not in a militant way or neither by reducing the protective Police forces. Training and intelligent allocation of resources and through getting out the vote will make change possible.
But one last time I believe those that think that serving themselves and believing that everything should be “PC” are doing an injustice to all in many instances and I do not believe that because of that I should wear the label of ignorance.

eyespy
Super Member
3 years ago

Legend. This one comment makes you one.

Good for you Ji-chan

Last edited 3 years ago by eyespy
gitchogritchoffmypettis
Legend
Reply to  Gorbachav5

At the same time, you have to recognize that there is a lot of money to be made and victim points to be scored these days and while some people really enjoy that game it’s also totally valid for other people to be a little sick of it. Because I am overeducated and fearless instead of ignorant and phobic (which are kind of cunty go to terms some people throw around because they are afraid to give a contrary opinion any measure of credence and they allow them to not listen to other POVs and feel morally superior doing it) I understand that this name change is a wet fart to either side. The name’s just not that offensive unless you really want to work at being offended. At the same time, it’s just not that big a deal to change it. Maybe it will make some overly sensitive people happy, though probably not, and it could even be cool to get a new name. Plus, new gear for everyone to buy AND in a few years everyone can get all up in arms and shit themselves about alt-rightness whenever anyone wears an old Indians hat. Everybody wins. But I seriously don’t see the major harm in changing the name…. or not changing it now that Wahoo is derst.

AnAngelsFan
Super Member
3 years ago

I agree on all points (except Johnny Bench, who I never saw, and therefore have no basis for comparison).

rez2405
Trusted Member
3 years ago

This whole #BauerToAnaheim thing on Twitter could quite possibly be setting up to be the greatest buttercup that we’ve ever seen.

I don’t understand any of it, especially for a guy with career ERA, FIP, and steamers all in the 4s

Fansince1971
Legend
3 years ago
Reply to  rez2405

It’s complete hype. Building up markets to increase what others will pay him. Right from the playbook.

gitchogritchoffmypettis
Legend
Reply to  rez2405

Bubut if Arte signs him it will show he’s totally cereal about championishness.

Eric_in_Portland
Legend
3 years ago
Reply to  rez2405

I’m a little turned off by his circus. That video is so full of “aren’t I wonderful and everyone wants me” that it makes me cringe a little. On the other hand I’m not turned off at all by his 1.73 ERA and 0.795 WHIP.

Cowboy26
Legend
3 years ago

Do you think PTP and Arte are turned off by the circus? All of the newest roster moves have come with the he has “great makeup to be part of our locker room and ball club” tag so does Trevor Bauer fit that profile?

Fansince1971
Legend
3 years ago

Cleveland Rocks!

The jersey can sport a bunch of different types of rocks.

matthiasstephan
Super Member
3 years ago
Reply to  Fansince1971

Drew Carey has been advocating for that (unwittingly) for years.
comment image

Last edited 3 years ago by matthiasstephan
red floyd
Legend
3 years ago

I’d rather go with Moon over Parma

eyespy
Super Member
3 years ago
Reply to  Fansince1971

They are minerals, Marie

eatgrasslikegoat
Member
3 years ago

how about the Cleveland redskins

ChillRIL
Member
3 years ago

How about the Cleveland Rivers of Fire? Naw, too many words. The Cleveland Symphony? Or is that too artsy? I’m not sold on the Spiders, although it definitely stands out. Any other suggestions?

Senator_John_Blutarsky
Legend
Reply to  ChillRIL

Cleveland Toxic Waste; Cleveland Rust-lers; Cleveland Mistakes by the Lake; Cleveland Pierogis

ChillRIL
Member
3 years ago

Other than that, it’s a fine city.

Biggiswrth
Trusted Member
3 years ago

Are we missing the obvious choice of Steamers?

GrandpaBaseball
Legend
3 years ago
Reply to  Biggiswrth

The late King George would agree to that.

Mia
Legend
Mia
3 years ago

Cleveland Rocks!

Senator_John_Blutarsky
Legend
Reply to  Mia

Who is Drew Carey?

Mia
Legend
Mia
3 years ago

The Price is Right guy? /s

Senator_John_Blutarsky
Legend
Reply to  Mia

Realizing that I really need to get a life for knowing this……

All the little kids growing up on the skids
Go “Cleveland rocks!”, “Cleveland rocks!”
Jumpin’ Jene Jene and Movin’ James Dean
Go “Cleveland rocks!”, “Cleveland rocks!”
“Cleveland rocks!”, “Cleveland rocks!”
“Cleveland rocks!”, “Cleveland rocks!”
“Cleveland rocks!”, “Cleveland rocks!”

Mamma knows but she don’t care
She’s got her worries too
Seven kids and a phoneo player
And the rent too

All the little chicks with their crimson lips
Go “Cleveland rocks!”, “Cleveland rocks!”
Livin’ in sin with a safety pin
Go “Cleveland rocks!”, “Cleveland rocks!”
“Cleveland rocks!”, “Cleveland rocks!”
“Cleveland rocks!”, “Cleveland rocks!”
“Cleveland rocks!”, “Cleveland rocks!”

I’ve got some records from World War II
I play ’em just like me grandad do
He was a rocker and I am too
Go “Cleeeveland rocks!”
“Yeah Cleeeveland rocks!”

Cleveland rocks!, Cleveland rocks!

source: http://www.lyricsondemand.com/tvthemes/drewcarey1997presentlyrics.html

Mia
Legend
Mia
3 years ago

comment image

Senator_John_Blutarsky
Legend

Well, signing Suzuki would better than being bitten by a Murder Hornet

red floyd
Legend
3 years ago

I’d be down with Suzuki for a year or so. It would also be a link to Nick.

Senator_John_Blutarsky
Legend
Reply to  red floyd

I would as well, it’s just needing to depend on 37 year-old catchers….

gitchogritchoffmypettis
Legend
Reply to  red floyd

Nick….. Swisher? Markakis?

red floyd
Legend
3 years ago

Really, gitch? You know better, and look at my avatar.

gitchogritchoffmypettis
Legend
Reply to  red floyd

Actually no. I totally didn’t get it…. Adenhart. What does Kurt Suzuki have to do with Nick Adenhart? I guessed those other guys because they were teammates.

Jeff Joiner
Editor
Legend
3 years ago

After the Adenhart tragedy Suzuki, a college teammate of John Wilhite, got a bunch of MLB players to autograph stuff and auctioned it off to raise funds for Wilhite.

It was a really class move. Abs he did more than just that.

gitchogritchoffmypettis
Legend
Reply to  Jeff Joiner

Ahhhhh, cool. I like Kurt Suzuki a lot as a “team guy”…. he’s always on winners and we could use that.

toad2065
Trusted Member
3 years ago

Would Suzuki com with his own wheelchair? Collecting old guys is a terrible way to build a team!

admkir
Trusted Member
3 years ago
Reply to  toad2065

Is Mathis available lol

Designerguy
Super Member
3 years ago
Reply to  admkir

But then we’d be out on Wilson. Is Granderson available?

Last edited 3 years ago by Designerguy
Jeff Joiner
Editor
Legend
3 years ago

I’m still focusing on Casali but barring that we’re going full time share anyway. Suzuki is fine a couple of days a week behind the dish and can actually be used as a pinch hitter on other days. Not ideal, but nobody outside Realmuto is.

gitchogritchoffmypettis
Legend

I’d totally take Suzuki unless we expect him to start 120 games.